The Tough Decisions Mavis Had To Make, To Create $40k In Revenue



Mavis Huntley

Wouldn't it be great to shop online without worrying about the way something fits or if you got the right size? If you haven't heard of Mavis Huntley and her company, Smithery Style, you're going to want to. They're an online and now in-person shop that not only sell gorgeous pieces that they like to refer to as elevated basics, but their mission is to have women across the country feel confident in their day-to-day from the moment you step in front of your closet to get dressed in the morning. How do they do it? By helping you figure out your body shape, giving style tips for those shapes, figuring out your 'WOW' colours, modelling the clothes on real women and curating collections each season of the best pieces for all different body shapes. Watch their daily try on's over on IG @smitherystyle or head to their website to figure out your shape.

The simple fact is, I’m good (some may say, great) at making people money and scaling businesses.
It’s my Superpower.
But, I can give you all the (proven) strategies in the world…
What I can’t do, though, is MAKE you implement them.
Changing the way you think, being receptive to change and let’s be honest, being damn right vulnerable when it comes to MAKING HARD DECISIONS, is why most people simply stay stuck.
They don’t want to feel uncomfortable.
They avoid making those hard decisions.
But Mavis, she deserves a freaking medal for ploughing through uncomfortable, being open, honest and vulnerable, in her determination to scale. And she’s going to share her story with you.
** The 5X Framework Accelerator Program is now open. Click here to know more. 

## Summary

Mavis Huntley, owner of Sneering Style, shares her journey from working in advertising to starting her own business, Voila, which evolved into Smithery, a physical store in Toronto offering personal styling sessions. In the Bringing Business to Retail podcast, Mavis discusses the challenges of making tough decisions and the importance of seeking support and guidance to grow. The conversation highlights the significance of being mindful of one’s shadow values, seeking support, and making difficult decisions to achieve success.

Mavis and Selena Knight discuss the importance of having difficult conversations to avoid problems in the future. They also discuss the significance of having a target audience and catering to their needs, as well as being mindful of one’s finances and making smart financial decisions.

Mavis shares her experience of having commitment issues in both her personal and business life and how Selena’s program helped her overcome them. Selena’s guarantee of helping Mavis make more money proved to be true, as Mavis has had her best months ever and made $30,000 in cash record.

The discussion delves into the importance of being all in and making sacrifices to achieve success. Mavis shares her recent experience of feeling like she had tried everything and was hitting a brick wall in terms of cash flow. However, after working with Selena, Mavis was able to change her mindset and focus on one pillar of her business, resulting in an extra $40,000 in cash flow and exceeding her sales goals.

The conversation also highlights the importance of understanding one’s target audience and catering to their needs, as well as being mindful of finances and making tough decisions to avoid going out of business. Mavis had to confront the issue of being taken advantage of by employees and have tough conversations with her staff to review how much she was paying them.

The discussion also explores how Smithery has changed the way they market to their customers by focusing on their target audience and making the shopping experience easy and less overwhelming.

Mavis’s vision for Smithery is to manufacture their own pieces, starting with the best white T-shirt for every body shape.

The podcast concludes with Mavis’s advice to persevere, be consistent, and break down challenges into manageable tasks. Mavis’s journey shows that with the right mindset, support, and tough decisions, success is achievable.

## Introduction
In this episode of the Bringing Business to Retail podcast, Selena Knight interviews Mavisundhi, the owner of Sneering Style, a retail business that has achieved massive success in a short period. Mavisundhi shares her story of how she started her business, the ups and downs she’s experienced, and the tough decisions she’s had to make to achieve her goals.

## Overview
Selena and Mavisundhi discuss the importance of clarity, confidence, and control in growing a successful business. They also touch on the benefits of being part of a Mastermind program, the challenges of being a retail business owner, and the importance of confronting difficult issues head-on. The conversation also highlights the value of being all-in and having “f*ck you” money as a safety net. The episode concludes with Mavisundhi sharing her big vision for Smithery and the importance of breaking down big goals into manageable tasks.

## Quotable Phrases
– “Clarity equals confidence equals control.” – Selena Knight
– “It’s not just about the money. It’s about creating a community.” – Mavisundhi
– “You have to be willing to confront the difficult things head-on, because they’re not going to go away.” – Selena Knight
– “The value of being all-in and having ‘f*ck you’ money as a safety net.” – Mavisundhi
– “Breaking it down right. Instead of being like, okay, so how many style sessions is that that I need to do? What’s the toward figuring it’s math, basic calculators.” – Mavisundhi
– “If you don’t do this, we’re not going to work.” – Mavisundhi

## Conclusion
In this episode, Selena Knight and Mavisundhi discuss the importance of clarity, confidence, and control in growing a successful business. They also touch on the benefits of being part of a Mastermind program, the challenges of being a retail business owner during COVID-19, and the importance of confronting difficult issues head-on. Mavisundhi shares her journey of starting Smithery, a shop by shape concept, and the challenges she faced in expanding the business. The conversation also highlights the importance of trust in retail and the drawbacks of commission-based sales. The new context sheds light on the challenges of partnership and the importance of having hard conversations to avoid future conflicts. The conversation also highlights the value of being all-in and having “f*ck you” money as a safety net. Mavisundhi’s experience with freelance work during COVID-19 emphasizes the importance of not having a safety net and borrowing money to grow a business. The conversation also highlights the benefits of working with a retail strategist and the success Mavisundhi experienced after working with Selena. Mavisundhi’s mindset shift, which allowed her to break down her goals and focus on strategic actions, was a key factor in her success. The realization that staff were taking more than they were giving and confronting them head-on was a tough but necessary decision that ultimately led to the success of Smithery. The conversation also highlights the importance of honing in on the target customer and making shopping easier for them. Mavisundhi’s big vision for Smithery involves breaking down big goals into manageable tasks and achieving them one step at a time.

## Quotes

> “I had to buy out Rena to face misery. And I think that was the day that I realized, like, I’m all in on this. Like, I sold my dream house, bought her out of it, went up with my life partner at the same time.”

> “I don’t know if you know this, but my business, when I had the stores, got to a point where we needed big cash injection. But I’d now been in business so long that banks don’t want to give you the money because you’re anyway, global Financial, cris all the things. So I sold my investment property, and so I had this big chunk of cash.”

> “Prior to [buying out Rena], I was more of a risk taker. I was like, can happen. Money will always come. Not the best, wisest way to run your business. But that really stopped me, my track being like, okay, this has to last.”

> “If you get somebody to do shipping the orders and some of that stuff, then you can focus on growing the company.”

> “It’s all these little small steps, all these actions, strategic actions right. That have put together and I’m all of a sudden I’m there.”

> “What’s the toward figuring it’s math, basic calculators.”

> “If I would have said to you, I can help change your mindset, that’s not my skill set.”

> “I had to review everybody how much I was paying everybody because that was where my leak was.”

> “I had to do what was best for my business and if those women chose to leave because of that, then that was going to be okay because I would find someone to come in. That’s a really hard pill to swallow.”

> “We’re really curating those collections in terms to augment sort of experience too.”

00:00:02 Speaker 1 

Hey there and welcome to the bringing business to retail podcast.If you’re looking to get more sales, more customers, master your marketing and ultimately take control of your retail or e-commerce business.Then you’re in. The right place. I’m Celina Knight, a retail growth strategist and multi award-winning store owner whose superpower is uncovering exactly what your business requires to move to the next level. I’ll provide you with the strategies, the tools and the insight you need. To scale your. Sure, all you need to do is take action. Ready to get started? Hey there and welcome to today’s episode of. The bringing business to retail podcast. 

00:00:55 Speaker 1 

Can I just say that I am so grateful that I get to be along with people for their journey as they grow their business. Now it’s, you know, it sounds so trite these days. Like the whole gratitude thing, I think every influencer. Yeah, they, they, that’s their every. Second word and it’s.Kind of lost its meaning, but I was sitting down with a friend of mine who is a life coach and just chatting to her about potentially bringing a life coach into our business to help our retail and ecommerce store owners. 

00:01:30 Speaker 1 

With some stuff that’s. Happening in their life that maybe isn’t business stuff and one of the reasons I don’t call myself a coach is. I’m not a very good.Coach like I’m. My brain thinks in dot points. My brain is constantly looking at the next steps and coaches really need to be in the moment and. Actively listening and thinking about what the other person needs without them knowing if that makes sense, whereas I’m like OK, here are the steps to make the thing happen. So my friend was saying to me that there is there are these things called shadow values and we talk about our golden values, which is the way that we kind of. 

00:02:10 Speaker 1 

Work in the world, but then there. Are these shadow values? Which are often have a negative connotation, but if. You know what they are. Then it will often help you see. Errors or repeat pattern behaviours that you’re doing in your life and why you do them and those shadow values are attention, belonging, control, sexuality, superiority, validation and money, and each one of those has a golden value, so you can. Go and look this. Stuff up but. Essentially, there is a way that you are perceived or a way that you act and behind that is the reason why. So when she told me this, I’m like, look, I already know mine. Like I can tell you what mine is right now, mine is. That’s the thing that fills my cup. 

00:03:01 Speaker 1 

Being able to see the results of the things that I have achieved or the people that I have helped. And the the golden value that is attributed to validation is inspiration. And when she told me that because I didn’t know this, but when she told me that I was like, ah, isn’t that funny? Because that is something that people say to me all the time that I inspire them to take action or I inspire them to make a change or to do something. So I was like, yeah, maybe. Maybe this this stuff is true? But knowing that validation is my shadow value is something I’ve had to be really mindful of, because it means sometimes my cup isn’t filled if I don’t have that validation. 

00:03:49 Speaker 1 

And you know that’s not necessary. A healthy thing, but I I never saw it like. That I just saw it as. I just want to make sure that the people that I’m helping are, you know, getting their results. On today’s episode, my cup is very full, my cup is overflowing because today I have Mavis Huntley on the show, who is a real retailer just like you, and she is going to be sharing her story about how her business started. A lot of the ups and downs that she’s, she’s experienced and where she’s heading. And and some of the. 

00:04:23 Speaker 1 

Things that she’s had to confront. Along the way, but Mavis turns up to Mavis is in our supercharge program. And she turns. Up to every call with a great big smile. And I’ve seen over the months just the confidence that she has in making tough decisions has completely changed. And one of the things that we like, one of the sayings in our business is. Clarity equals confidence equals control so. If you are clear on what you want. That will give you. The confidence to take action and once you have that confidence and you take that action, you feel like you’re in control or you are in control of your business. And so it’s been an absolute joy to watch Mavis grow in her business and just see the leaps and bounds. From someone who was very skeptical. 

00:05:13 Speaker 1 

About how being in a mastermind could actually help her grow her business, meanwhile. She’s kicking it out of the park. She’s exceeding her goals. But she’s had to make. Some really hard decisions and have some really hard conversations along the way. So I am sure that you are going to love today’s episode with Mavis Huntley, and if you are interested in coming and hanging out in. Our 5X program or our supercharge program. Drop me a DM. We’ll get you on a call with our team. And see if. It would be. A good fit. Alright, let’s jump into today’s episode with Mavis Huntley, some Smithery style. Hey there and welcome to today’s episode of the Bring business to Retail podcast. Today, I have on the show, Mavis and Mavis is the owner of a retail business. And you guys, she’s freaking fantastic. I am so inspired by it. I am so inspired by the thing that things that she’s done in just a very short period of time that I had to have her on the. Show to tell you all about the. UPS and the downs and the massive wins, and let’s be honest, there’s been a few kick in the guts. As well, over the last few. Bumps, but realistically you have done some amazing things and you’ve, like, kicked it out of the. Park with sales goals. So welcome to the show, Mabus. 

00:06:30 Speaker 2 

Thank you for having me. I think This is why exactly why I work with you, because I need this. Like pump up every time that we talk to each other. 

00:06:39 Speaker 1 

I I never say that I’m the cheerleader, right?You’re saying I am. 

00:06:44 Speaker 2 

Say today I’m gonna give. It to you, OK. 

00:06:47 Speaker 1 

You give me lots of credit, lots of credit. Alright, tell us about smithery. Actually, before we even get started. How did you get into retail? You came from. I remember talking to you. The first time and I’m like. What you did? Before and what you’re doing now are like two different halves of the brain that. 

00:07:07 Speaker 2 

So I I don’t know. If you have have the. The TV show who’s the? Boss is the right word. 

00:07:14 Speaker 1 

You’ve had it, yeah. 

00:07:17 Speaker 2 

How is the right word? For that, but there was a lot. 

00:07:18 Speaker 1 

We’re showing our page. 

00:07:20 Speaker 2 

Yes, we there was a woman on. There, Angela Bauer. She worked at an ad agency. She was an exec and. Ever since, yeah, this shoulder pad. 

00:07:27 Speaker 1 

I just remembered the pads. 

00:07:30 Speaker 2 

And ever since I saw that I wanted to be an advertising for some reason. So off I went and that’s what I did for many, many years. And I worked at an ad agency. I was a producer, so much mutually involved, like in the creative field of it and creating like commercials and ads. And that kind of thing. So, you know, made my way up during those years. And when I started smithery, I was sitting on the executive. Team and really. Happy in my job and what I was doing. So yes, this was like a big left left turn for me. Why retail, though? So why retail? You know what? It didn’t start. With retail and. I actually feel very lucky about that, so I know a lot of people that have that entrepreneurship gene. And want to do something but they don’t have the idea, whereas the idea came to me and I feel extremely lucky about that. So so how it all started is I was, yeah, working as an exact in this ad agency. I had like 20 plus people. You know reporting in to me was doing really well in my career but yet I didn’t feel confident every day. I was, you know, kind of fumbling around. And every day and I. Soon realized that it went right. Back to the moment. When I was getting dressed in the morning so I would stand in front. Of my closet. 

00:08:48 Speaker 1 

Was it shoulder pads? Did you need shoulder pads? 

00:08:51 Speaker 2 

That’s where I went wrong. I was wearing. Andrew Bauer fashion too. So yeah, it’s good for my closet not liking anything in it. Just grabbing something. And it basically. Set the tone for the rest of my. Day and what happened is at work there was a very stylish coworker.We actually started the company together in the beginning. She no longer she left a few years ago and I’m running it now, but she was taking like styling courses on the side. And she started giving me these. Tips and tricks I haven’t explained what Smither. Is, but this is gonna. This is gonna get this. Yeah, we’ll get there.But she started giving me tips and tricks on how to dress, and it changed everything about my day because at the time, you know, I didn’t like shopping. I didn’t have time to shop. I buy off the mannequin. It wouldn’t look like that. So once I started following these tips and tricks or rules. My entire closet changed and I would go to my closet in the morning, find pieces that I love, feel great in them, and I realized it. It changed my entire day so that confidence sort of led me throughout the entire day. And then I thought there must be more women like. Me out there. Voila, Smithery was born. Yeah, so I look. I have a really. 

00:10:05 Speaker 1 

I know if this is just a me question, but yeah. When she was giving you these tips? Did you feel a little bit hurt? But were you like ohh, you know? Thanks but like and inside you were kind of dying or you were like ohh thanks. 

00:10:20 Speaker 2 

Give me more.I was more on the side of thanks. Give me more. Like I always knew I wasn’t fashion forward like I was a hoodie and flip flop kind of girl. 

00:10:29 Speaker 1 

Yeah, that’s enough. 

00:10:31 Speaker 2 

But my career was. Sort of moving. Beyond that, and I had to. No, I was like give. Me all the tips and because they were working. That I had feeling. I felt so much better and I was like, Oh yeah, this does look better, right? Like then you start to trust someone. So yeah, I was all for it. I was not. I did not. Feel hurt in the. 

00:10:48 Speaker 1 

Least do you know what maybe like? Nowadays it’s like now you can. Turn off to working hoodies. And flip flops because you know the whole creating space.Is that super cool? I don’t know. That’s a good thing or a. Bad thing, but yeah. Regardless of that, the fact is you have a thriving business now, so how did so? And then Smithery was born. Tell us a little bit more about that process. And what is smithery? 

00:11:15 Speaker 2 

So I’ll start off by telling you what Smithery is today. So the concept started out it was. Shop by shape. So we found out early on being the good advertising executives that we are. We did our research and we found out that only one in 10 women knew what their body shape is. And that’s really the key to finding. That’s that fit and flatter and make you feel good. So that was our hook when we started. 

00:11:41 Speaker 2 

And So what we introduced was shop by shape. So the concept of smithery was we would help women figure the body shape. Give them tips and. Trick and then curate collections of clothing each season that flatter those different body shapes at the end of the day. And we started out, it was just supposed to be. A website, so I’m sure. We’ll we’ll we’ll go into that. But what we wanted women to do was to be able to go on to the website use. Our shape Finder. Figure out the body shape and once they knew that they could punch it into the website and for example, if you’re an A because we got rid of those awful fruit, none of us want to be a banana or pear, so we have we have 5 letters, and if you were an A then it would pull up everything that’s good for an A. Essentially want to make shopping for those women that did not like it or didn’t have the time as easy as possible in terms of that then. 

00:12:33 Speaker 1 

So you said originally saw it as a. But now like now you’re expanding. So tell us but that. Has come with quite a. So let’s talk about. Like, how did you decide that? I’m going to do this in person to begin. 

00:12:50 Speaker 2 

So my partner and I, so we are you know we are still working at the ad agency. So we started working on the business on weekends and nights and that kind of thing. And then I think I went down to three days a week. So it’s still an exact at and you know major agency in Canada and then went down to three days. So I could focus on smithery. And then I got pregnant. And what happened then? Is it allowed me because I had Matt Lee from this ad agency. So it allowed me to sort of take. That next leap. With a little bit of a cushion there. Right, so I took three. Months off and then strapped Charlie, my daughter to my to my waist and then diet. With Smithery in terms of the next few months and then I didn’t end up going back to the ad agency after that Matt lead. 

00:13:39 Speaker 1 

There’s like many. 

00:13:40 Speaker 2 

Ups and downs in between that, so I don’t even think like oh, this just worked out and she, you know, Smither is paying her. No, Smither is not paying me at that time. So what I did is what a lot of us do in advertising is I worked freelance. On the side. So I made free with freelance my side gig and smothering my main gig, so I was. Working sort of both through. And so yeah, the website, what happened is people were into the concept. So we got some media coverage right away. Luckily, being in the advertising world, you know they have dailies and weeklies that we got showcased in for doing that. But what kept? Happening is our customers were like I went on your website, I did the. Shape binder I. Still don’t know my body shape can. I come in. And I was like. OK. And I’ll meet you at a coffee shop with. My measuring taste. 

00:14:26 Speaker 1 

With my baby on. 

00:14:28 Speaker 2 

Yeah, with my baby on my. Back it wasn’t. Like the most ideal, but it kept on. So we were like, OK, clearly we. Need a location? So we opened up in downtown Toronto on the 4th floor in the smallest little studio possible. But the idea for that was like just to have a location with some of the racks, with clothing up that people can come in and we would do their measurements and sort of. Help them and that. Sort of parlayed into all of the services that we offer now. That became official services and we thought. There’s a need for this so people can now nowadays. Book style sessions with us, so those turned into like, OK, we can make some money on these instead of just letting people come in and we start because the services we are giving clearly were needed and not out there in the market. So we started booking style sessions into that space and. 

00:15:19 Speaker 1 

You only have to go to any. You know any sort of chain store retailer and I’m thinking, you know, the old navies and the gaps and things like that. And the person who comes to help you, they’re on Commission. You know, they’ve got targets. They’re gonna tell you everything looks great and you’re putting something on. And you’re like, I look like crap and. 

00:15:37 Speaker 2 

They’re like, Oh my God. 

00:15:38 Speaker 1 

You look so great and you’re like. No, no, I. So now I have absolutely no trust that you’re going to give me anything that’s going to look good on me. 

00:15:48 Speaker 2 

Well, it’s exactly that. So our our main target, our main customer that shops with us, we call them new moms. But it’s moms that have had kids from sort of like a year old until like, they’re 16/17/18 of age range. And that’s because exactly what you say, right is that we we. Found a gap in the market in. Terms of where do those women? Shock that they feel comfortable in, that there’s they they’re not like they haven’t like age. So they still want to be cool and trendy. You want to be the clue, Mom. That pick up, right? You still want to know what’s happening, but it doesn’t mean you have to. But you want an age appropriate? I feel like, uh, lifestyle appropriate even more so because you’ve got kids and you’re doing more active and you’re doing different things. The clothes need to be more durable, essentially. So yeah, that would that definitely right, like. Helpless because I. Would go into Aritzia. It’s a major chain that we have here and it’s like teenagers bringing me crop tops and I. Like, do I look like I wear a? 

00:16:48 Speaker 1 

I look like I wear. 

00:16:49 Speaker 2 

A crop top. And saying look good and like it. Doesn’t doesn’t look good. 

00:16:53 Speaker 1 

No, doesn’t look good, all right. So the transition from freelance gig, I think this is probably when I met you, which, let’s be honest, was only like 5 or six months ago, was it very. Long ago, but. You still had a foot in each camp, so. What was the thing that made you go? I am all in so. 

00:17:18 Speaker 2 

It’s it’s funny. So I I talked about. Having a partner. Before right business partner, that kind of crumbled in 2019. So it’s interesting I this is a lesson for anybody, you know, listening to this right now. We were very good about having the top conversations in the beginning to. Create a shareholder agreement that thought through all of these things and at the time you know everything is like rainbows and butterflies and you don’t think anything bad will ever happen? 

00:17:48 Speaker 1 

But great, good, good on you because. So many people don’t do that. 

00:17:52 Speaker 2 

And they were. It was terrible. The conversations looked terrible. I remember run an eye meeting and we would, like, do everything else on our To Do List and then we just like, shove that to the end. We would never get to it. So then we had to flip the switch and be like we have to. Tackle this first. We have to have. These hard conversations and then we’ll go into the rest. Happened is she had. A baby neither of us had kids when we started. And what she realized is that she didn’t want. To do this after she had a baby. So that was. A really tough. Time and probably shook me the most during first during my years with you were about 8 years old now. And so it was. I had, like you and I talked about this, and I’m trying to get teary eyed about it. But it was funny when I started smithery what I always had in the back of my mind is that I had my house like if everything. Goes because we bootstrapped this ourselves. So I’m like if everything goes belly up, I could sell my house like that was sort of the thing that would get me through and never thought I’d have to do it. But yeah, so I had to buy a Rena to save smithery. And I think that was the day that I realized like. I am all in on this like I sold my Dream House, bought her out of it, split up with my life partner at the same time because you know, why not combust your whole world at the same time. And so there I was, a single mother, you know, in a rental. But I was so happy because I was like, this was the moment that it taught me that this is exactly what I want. 

00:19:16 Speaker 1 

One of those situations my husband and I have this conversation and we call it the FU money. And so he did something very similar. 

00:19:22 Speaker 2 


00:19:25 Speaker 1 

So when I so I, I don’t know if you know this, but my business when I had the stores got to a point where we needed a big cash injection. But I’d now been in business so long that banks don’t want to give you the money because you’re anyway global financial crisis, all the things. So I sold. My investment property and so I had this big chunk of cash and I remember being at the store 1. Day and my husband turns up and I’m like. What are you doing here? It’s like I quit. 

00:19:56 Speaker 2 

What? What like? 

00:19:58 Speaker 1 

We’ve not had this conversation. It’s like I quit. We’ve got the SU money now, like we have enough money to live. Ohh, like I’m gonna get another job like a, but I’m just. But we’re OK. We have this cushion and making a big commitment. Like selling your property. It really puts everything into perspective, because now you’re like. This money runs out. Like I have to be very, very. Mindful about what I spend my money on. But can we just like we wine for a second? Because I’m thinking. Like I know a little bit of the INS and outs of your business. Why did you have to sell your house to pay her out? Because the business. Like I’m not going to be. Rude here, but the business wasn’t worth. 

00:20:42 Speaker 2 

So you said. A lot of money back then, yes, yes. But when you have no. Money. It’s worth some money. Yeah, because I’m putting everything into it already, right? So this is. And, you know, we were using lawyers like it wasn’t like the. Cleanest, nicest break even despite we had all that. So I was hoping to make installment payments, but I needed to make one lump sum and I need to make it within a. Certain amount of. 

00:21:09 Speaker 1 

Did you not think of just like abandoning the whole thing and starting up a new venture? 

00:21:13 Speaker 2 

You know what? It didn’t cross my mind it. 

00:21:15 Speaker 1 

So that would. 

00:21:17 Speaker 2 

I would have been like. 

00:21:20 Speaker 1 

Just I’ll just call it something else. 

00:21:22 Speaker 2 

Baby is mine. Do not take it away. Do not take my dreams. Away with it. OK. And I’m so glad I did, because look, look at how it’s evolved now, like if I that’s definitely been a pivotal moment in the smithery story good and bad because it actually made me, I I would say prior to that and you know this about me is that prior to that I was more of a risk taker. I was like, really? Bad can happen. Money. You always come not. Not the best wise way to run your business, but that really like stopped me in my tracks. Being like, OK. 

00:21:56 Speaker 1 

Yeah, I’ve got this chunk of cash and. This this has. 

00:21:58 Speaker 2 

To last, yeah, yeah. 

00:22:01 Speaker 1 

This is why I why I actually like when people borrow money. And remember, I’m not a financial advisor. I’m not telling you to borrow money, but when you borrow money to grow a business. You have a liability now, like you have to pay the bank. It’s like a mortgage. You have to pay the bank back. So you have this. 

00:22:19 Speaker 2 

It’s more simple. 

00:22:21 Speaker 1 

Yeah, there’s more stake in the game and you’ve got someone whipping whipping your **** saying, you know you have to make the money to. Pay this back. Whereas if you kind of. Just put a chunk of cash in. Maybe you withdrew it from your mortgage or you’ve had it in savings. We think there’s that impetus. To do the hard work. But there kind of isn’t because. Yeah, until you get down to those last, you know. Dollars. You’re like there’s money. In the bank, there’s like, you’ve got that safety net. But actually when you don’t have the safety net is when you make big leaps and bounds because you have to put yourself out there, you have to make decisions instead of putting them off just like you. 

00:23:01 Speaker 2 

Although, like I did put. The ball, you. Know for after until I met you. Well, then COVID hit right. And so we were just sort of in survival mode and that’s, you know, not knowing what was going to happen with the world I took on even more freelance like it took on almost smithery became secondary. For those two years and my freelance gigs became the full time job because. You just didn’t know what was going. So yeah, that was the yeah. So a big, you know, another pivot point for me is. Yeah, it was like March of this year. It’s one year since I’ve lived off Smithery fully and not done freelance. So I given myself I you know, I stopped my last freelance gig at March. Last year and I was like, OK, Mavis, give yourself until the end of the year. Don’t take any more gigs. Like, see if you can do it, but I think also doing that help me push through too because before I can just say to him I’ll just do. The second man. Yeah, that was my safety net. And so now look where I am. 

00:24:05 Speaker 1 

So tell us what now looks like. 

00:24:09 Speaker 2 

So yeah, so I started working with you like we started talking, I guess back in like December, November. Of last year. 

00:24:15 Speaker 1 

It’s right here. 

00:24:17 Speaker 2 

Yeah. And then. 

00:24:19 Speaker 1 

That was a very funny conversation. 

00:24:23 Speaker 2 

OK, I I’m gonna. I’m gonna get a synopsis up this conversation because Sal. Nailed who I am as a person and like literally half an hour so. I I’ve always had all my friends and family who know this. I’ve always had like commitment issues in my personal personal life. I’ll come as no surprise, but. 

00:24:39 Speaker 1 

So of course we didn’t get. 

00:24:41 Speaker 2 

Into that in that conversation. But we were talking about business and Sal said to me at the end of the conversation, it was all smothering and she was like, I know what your problem is. She’s like, you have commitment issues. Like lady, you don’t even know the half. But it did. It was eye opening to me because I realized. That those issues. Weren’t only my, you know, personal life? They’re also in my business life as well. And so I think the how or the work that you and I have done has not only. And like teaching me how to run a small business because I. Just kind of fell into this. But also mindset, right? It’s like it’s it’s the mindset around it as well in terms of that. Just moving forward I. 

00:25:20 Speaker 1 

Remember you saying to me so you remember that? I don’t remember that I remember you saying to me. I said I said something along the lines of, but if I could guarantee you that you would make more money. Yeah, like, would that be a deciding factor to work with me and I don’t be saying you can’t guarantee me that how can you guarantee me that I will make more money? Like you can’t. You can’t do that and. I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah, I can like. I I promise you this. Is the deal. 

00:25:52 Speaker 2 

And so yeah. So OK, this goes. I’ll tell you what, I was skeptical. I probably was, like, sounds worse like potential clients because I was like, well, asking for this and dead and. I don’t trust this. But it’s used OK. And I think this also goes to you. Myself, I’m very sensitive. Not calling you a coach. Because I know. That you don’t like. That retail strategist. 

00:26:13 Speaker 1 

I’m not a very. Good coach, that’s why. That’s why I don’t ever call myself a coach. I am not a good coach, right? 

00:26:20 Speaker 2 

But you see on the Internet right now there’s this whole trend, right of everybody’s a coach. Everybody can help, right? So I’m like, how do I know that you? Can really help me? When all these other people are saying. That, but that was the guarantee. That was what was different. And then what happened? 

00:26:37 Speaker 1 

So tell tell us what happened. Let’s talk about how Mavis has made. I don’t know. I’m gonna go, like $30,000 in cash. Record best months ever tell. Us cause you know you’ve told us about it. And let’s be honest, there’s been some kicking the guts in there. Just just recently. It’s not all like you said, not all unicorns and. 

00:26:59 Speaker 2 

Yeah, I think I think that’s been, yeah. OK. So yes, you were right. You got my money back. I got my money back there. So for me, I think I was putting my head in the sand, right, so. New things are bad at the end of the last quarter of last year, just like a lot of small businesses. And I felt like I was hitting my head against a brick wall in terms of I’ve tried everything. There’s nothing else to try. This is it. Sort of thing. This might be the end of smithery, and so when we started meeting, I started, wasn’t it? 

00:27:32 Speaker 2 

There’s lots of many other strategies. To use, but I love how you make us focus on one of the pillars, right? So I was jumping around everywhere. Uh, in the business, not acting like a CEO, but more so because I was so desperate for cash flow that I thought I had to do everything in order to save money. I was like, I can’t afford to pay some money this much money I have to. Do it and essentially like once I changed that whole mindset. Which you showed me. You’re like, OK, what’s a, you know, if you get somebody to do shipping the orders and some of that stuff, then you can focus on. Growing the company, I literally. Three months ago. Probably didn’t think that was possible I. Was like I. Don’t even know how that’s. And then since Sam and. I started working together. Yeah, I’ve made an extra like $40,000, definitely in cash flow. Got rid of like my old stock, tripled, like she showed me a pre sales strategy, which I had. 

00:28:33 Speaker 2 

One goal I ended up tripling that goal with it, but just in terms of mindset, I was always like discounting things or. You know, in desperation trying to get. Cash flow and who is that I? Actually don’t have to. Do that in order to achieve that. And then the other you know, the other thing that we’re doing too, we. Hired 2 more stylists. So we only had myself and another one, so I. Was running myself ragged with. And and then we’re opening up our storefront, our first retail storefront. So I went going into working with, I went and going to work with you, being like this year is just like, I just need to catch up. I just need to like figure out how I’m going to survive and like you know, pay off some debt. I, you know, locked up last year into like. One of Smitty’s biggest growth years is going to be 2023. If we keep at it. And I would say that’s the. Other thing too is like my mindset. That you totally switched around because. Do you remember was? 

00:29:30 Speaker 1 

March, March, March 14. I think it was. 

So you got a replay of Mavis on the call on around March 14 this year. 

00:29:41 Speaker 2 

So, but this is the thing I I have my head in the sand. So money pillar was the pillar that I needed to focus on. Because Smiley is making good money, but for some. Reason we weren’t profitable because. I was just spending that money. Stupidly or not, you know managing it well. But now I have these tools in place, so now I. Focus on it. So I’m watching that, you know, on a weekly basis, I. Know where we’re. Sitting where we have to hit, but still my. Mindset wasn’t there. So on March. 14th I was like, OK. Here’s our goal. For for the. Month we’re nowhere close to it. The old me, this the old Mavis would have just. Been like, OK. March is awash. Not gonna happen. I’ll try. But you’re like, no, no. No, you still have two weeks left. And then I ended. Up hitting our target in those two weeks so. 

00:30:28 Speaker 1 

Not only did you hit your target. You are halfway to your stretch goal. So you exceeded your target? 

00:30:35 Speaker 2 

Exceeded my target of 5000. Yeah, 5000 away from. 

00:30:38 Speaker 1 

My stretch goal. 

00:30:39 Speaker 2 

So I know it, so that’s why I was saying it’s this mix of like knowledge that I have now how to run a business, but also the mindset piece, right, the big learning for me has been and I’m sure there’s other people like this. When you feel. So far away like that, like from your goal or that you need so much money, you know, to get to the next goal. I’m one of being like, well, this isn’t going to make me all of it. Then what’s the point? Whereas what’s happened, I think and really turned my business around is it’s all these little small steps. All these actions strategic actions, right? That it put together and then all of a sudden I’m there like I wake up and I was like, Oh my God, we did it like, I’m like, so that has been a huge shift for me in terms of my. 

00:31:28 Speaker 1 

Mindset like you just pulled money out of thin air. 

00:31:32 Speaker 2 

Yeah, and it’s breaking down it right instead of being like, OK, so how many style sessions is that that I need to? Do how many orders and what’s the average? Order like just figuring. It’s it’s math. Basically no my strongs. Yeah, that’s what we have. Yeah, but now that I can break it. Down like that and. See that it makes it so much more. Achievable and doable. 

00:31:54 Speaker 1 

So one of the things that you’ve said over and over again is mindset. My question to you is on that first call that we had, if I would have said to you, I can help change your. Mindset, which is not, that’s not my skill set. Right, my skill. Set is just showing you freaking obvious and kind of laying it out. But would that have been something that you would have latched on to, or you have gone, oh, just another freaking guru trying to change my mind? To what I would have said. 

00:32:23 Speaker 2 

I would have said that and. I would have said that’s. Not my problem. Any cash flow? Right, that’s what I would have said. It wasn’t until we started working together that I realized that I had a mindset issue as well, like I think. Yeah, it’s part and parcel. 

00:32:37 Speaker 1 

Do you think that you avoided making money? I’ve just got a scenario that I’m thinking of when you and I had a conversation about how profitable your styling sessions were. And you were having a contract to come in and you were. Making a whole $5. On if you’re watching the video, Mavis is like covering her face is going. Don’t tell the people about. This, but what did you think? 

00:33:07 Speaker 2 

I didn’t even realize though you pointed that out to me. So here I. Had been like this. All sessions are so great. I was like we both were like 20. Five this month why we got the money. You’re like cause. You made $100 total, I’m like. 

00:33:21 Speaker 1 

Hey so this is. This has been a common theme amongst. All of our supercharged people, which is. I’m going to go out on a limb here and say being taken advantage of by your employees. Because it’s happened to, I think pretty much everyone in. 

00:33:39 Speaker 1 

The program that. The realisation that your staff are taking more than they’re giving. And you had to confront that. So can you tell us a little bit about, like, what was going? Through your mind. When you realized you were making $5 off off somebody’s services. And you’re like, we have all this money coming in, but we have no cash and then we’ve realized that this was the problem and it didn’t go very smoothly at all, did it? 

00:34:06 Speaker 2 

So hard conversations to have. And here’s the thing. Is I’m gonna. Take accountability for how we ended up there. Would I have abundance? I want to share that abundance right like. You know, I want everybody to be happy. And I want, you know, and I’m like, so grateful that they’re even, like working for me or helping me. That doesn’t make a profitable business, and so that was my mindset. Like you have really great women that work for me, right, that I respect and are very skilled, yet I had to review everybody how much I was paying everybody because that was where my leak was like. So when I had my spreadsheet that I now. Saw it all broke down, you know on. A on a weekly. 

00:34:48 Speaker 2 

Monthly basis instead of yearly. I could see where those money leaks were and here it was and I. Was like, why is this the case? So yeah, I had to like so here, you know. Women that I still wanted. To work for me that I respected and needed. I had to. Have this tough conversations with them to be like. OK, I can’t. Give you bonus anymore. Like, that’s not how I’m taking that away or I know you wanted a raise or more money, but. It’s not happening. Like it’s trying to come. To terms with that is that like I had to do what was best for my business and if those women chose to leave? Because of that, then that was going to be OK because I would find someone to. That’s a really hard pill to swallow. 

00:35:30 Speaker 1 

Oh, it’s very hard. Yeah, but at the same time, you don’t serve anyone if you go. Out of business. This is what? 

00:35:36 Speaker 2 

I was going to say that was. That’s what my realization was, is that if I don’t do this, we’re not going to. None of us have enough, and we’re to work, yeah. 

00:35:44 Speaker 1 

Yeah. And and there was. There was fight back, but in the end. The staff stayed. You actually about. Bringing on more staff and then you put a structure in place which was like senior stylist and junior stylist and you. Put the price up. Yeah, and guess what? And what happened to your bookings? Did they go down, Mavis? When you put the. 

00:36:05 Speaker 2 

No, not not because. Of the price. Because the price it’s location issues in. There, but again to show you. That it’s not like, uh, you know, it’s. Always up and downs of everything, yeah. 

00:36:16 Speaker 1 

But you really resisted. That price rise? You honestly thought your customers wouldn’t spend? It and I. Don’t know if I’ve told you this, but coach Steph, who’s on our team, who does our about accountability calls. I remember her sending me a message. I was on the bus coming back from CEO club. And she had just gotten off of a call. With you, she sends me a picture and she says. Who the heck pays $77.00 for a white T-shirt and she sends me. A picture of your website. And I wrote back and I said the same client. So we have another client who pays 100. And $50.00 for. This white T-shirt and it’s got just a tiny little emblem in the corner, pretty much the same white T-shirt and. Stuff it’s like. Well, that’s just stupid. It’s like it might be stupid to you. But it’s not stupid to mavis’s customers and. 

00:37:05 Speaker 2 

This this was. 

00:37:07 Speaker 1 

To me one. Of the biggest eye openers was that your pet? Or weren’t necessarily price sensitive? You thought they were when you brought? In corporate wear. And you were. Like ohh excuse me, they don’t want to spend the money and I’m like, no, no, no, no, no, it’s not that. They don’t want to spend the money. There’s something else missing here, because we have proven over and over again that they will spend $77.00 on spending $7070 on a white sheet. T-shirt as much as. I love you, but I’m. Gonna. Yeah. So what, like? Can we just talk a little bit about? How you have changed the way I guess you market cause this is something that realistically and you are not the only person. Who’s done this? You came from a marketing and advertising background. You could have had. This stuff nailed right. Should be able to send the ice. To Eskimos and you’re saying they don’t want corporate wear? Well, they did want corporate wear. So what did you change? 

00:38:05 Speaker 2 

Yeah, I think. I think it’s putting like not and I think a lot of shop owners get caught in. This is like buying what you want all the time, right? And your style and your, you know, spend like the amount of money that you would spend. No, I was we really focused on who our target was instead of trying to please everybody. So that you know the the customer that I talked about earlier, we’ve really honed in on that customer and are talking to her in terms of of that. And so that has sort of led us and now I feel like we’ve so many loyal customers, that’s the beauty of being around for a bit longer. Is I have. Certain customers sort of in my mind when we’re, you know, marketing and selling things because they represent sort of that scale of it. That’s Uber helpful too. 

00:38:57 Speaker 1 

But I think the when you went right back to the beginning of this conversation, you said the whole reason for starting smithery was to give people a really easy way to shop. Yeah, that’s one of the things that you’ve started readopting into your business is how do I put these things together to make it easy for people to shop? 

00:39:16 Speaker 2 

And that has been, you’re right. We have really focus on that. As a consumer. Will help them shop easier in Canada. So what’s definitely moved the needle for us is because we represent different body shapes. So we have five different body shapes, and So what we do on our social and our Instagram is we have try ONS every day. So when new arrivals come on, we don’t just put. Them on the website. We try them on the different body shapes, so and people get we use the same person each week, so there’s that consistency that people get to know and they know that like, OK, my body is similar to Susan’s. My body is similar to Mavis. And so each day we have real women and sort of doing those try ONS and showing and we’re and we’re being totally honest how we feel about them. So I could love something as an A on Tuesday when I do my try ONS and then Taylor, who’s an O does her. Try ONS on Wednesday. 

00:40:14 Speaker 2 

And will love something else and not love the thing. And I tried on. And so we’re really open and honest and. That’s like we we see the journey that our customers take in terms of purchases. Because the new arrivals will go on the site. Right. We could see. People visiting the site, looking at them, you know, the savvy people, there’s a couple of, you know, purchases. But you could tell like the people what day they’re waiting for. The try ONS of who? To do that. And then the other thing I pride ourselves on is inner product descriptions. So if you go to a lot of retail stores, they slap the piece up, right? And they say like. Here’s the size I’ll give you the basic information, whereas we tell you what body shape it’s wow on, but one it’s also good on what we also do color analysis. So we we tell. Each our customers what seasonal palette like they are and and what color flower them. So in there. So once they do that with us they can see in the product description this. Color flatters these seasons and then we say fit and they’re like oversized. This is what size Susan wears. This is what size Mavis wears. This is size, right? So it’s like basically we’re just coming at it at every angle to say what would make someone shopping experience easy. Yeah, and less overwhelmed. That is the word we use all the time. We’re like we want. Take the overwhelm or shopping, essentially. 

00:41:31 Speaker 1 

And it because. You can’t go to a big box retailer and get this. I can’t go on to a gap website and type in my shape and get all the things on my colour. Like for me it’s colour more than anything because I’m spring and people don’t make this colour anymore. They just want those. Muted mustards and plums and all those sorts of things, and I I can literally walk into a store now, and even my daughters like this. She’ll walk and she go. There’s nothing for you here. Let’s just say. Like there’s nothing for you. Let’s let’s leave. 

00:42:00 Speaker 2 

Well, and that’s a very it’s a very good point that you make because we actually when we curate our collections, so the brands that we carry and the pieces that we carry. We’re not just going out and. Buying in the season? Or, you know, for the next season saying, OK, what’s cute, what’s on trend? That’s not our MO. We have like a matrix like the wholesale reps that. We deal with like I’m sure. They’re like powering when we come in because we need to make sure do we have enough bottoms for each of those body shape? 

00:42:28 Speaker 1 

Over the season. 

00:42:28 Speaker 2 

Do we have Blazers that flatter each of those body shapes and then the color? So we’re like, we’re not bringing just one in like we need to make sure, do we have enough, you know, pieces or spring like you right, like over each season. So we’re really curating those collections in terms to augment sort of experience too. 

00:42:47 Speaker 1 

And and that to me that just embodies your whole mission. That’s exactly what you wanted to do. So, yeah, what’s the future for smithery? What’s the big vision? 

00:42:59 Speaker 2 

Everybody asked me that I. Just filled out this form and that was the thing in there too, it’s. Like, OK, I’ll tell you. Like my, my vision is my 6 year old who might hear coming in and out is is I. Was like I’m going to. Create this company and it’s going to be a family run company that’s going to grow and. Grow and I’m. Going to hand it down to her and she told me. You know, a couple months ago that it’s OK, mom, I don’t. I don’t want Smither so. 

00:43:25 Speaker 1 

A lot of a lot of people think that, though, and and then maybe comes, I mean, do you ever watch any of those shows like, you know, the Prophet and you know, Country house rescue, all those kind of rescue type show? Quite often, the kids feel an obligation to take on the business when they never actually wanted to be there, and what ends up happening is the business gets run into the ground because they’re not passionate. About the thing. And yeah, I can’t imagine Lana wanting to come into my business. Although she can. I just can. I just sidebar here. We will watch you. I will make you rich. I will teach you to be rich on Netflix. 

00:44:03 Speaker 2 

You. Yeah, yeah. 

00:44:04 Speaker 1 

She was watching it with me and they’re talking about financial. Manners, and this is like one of those moments. When you’re like oh. My God, I raised my child right. And she said to me, So what I find, if someone had a retail store and they went to a financial planner, cause I was explaining how financial planners get commissioned. She’s like, so would they tell them to invest in your program?And I’m like. That’s a really. Good question, but no, because I don’t work with financial planners and yeah, and she’s like but. Surely if they’re advising someone to buy stocks or shares, they can’t guarantee that you will make. Do they guarantee you will make money like? Is that how it works? I said, oh, no, no, they don’t guarantee she. Said. But you guarantee. Someone will make money. Like I don’t understand. Why would someone invest in something that isn’t guaranteed to make them money? But they wouldn’t be advised to invest in something. That is guaranteed to make the money. I’m like ohh my. God, you wanna come and work for my company? That’s so good. She’s so she’s. She’s not interested, right? I know she’s not interested. So that I mean if if people take nothing away from. This conversation, or though they should take. A lot is this concept of. Building a legacy. It’s kind of a defunct vision because unless you, you know, you’re Chanel or someone like that. It it’s just not gonna happen. You 2 generations from now, no one’s. Gonna know who you are, and that’s OK. So then it’s like, OK, if I gotta get this altruistic, I want to build a legacy out of my head, actually. What do I want? 

00:45:34 Speaker 2 

Yeah, like and. And I think you know this, but is like. I want to start. We have so much. Data. So much information. We’ve met with so many women, I I talk about our style sessions as like therapy sessions essentially. And so yeah, I just want to grow sort of everything we talked about today. Like what does smithery and body. And I think the next step. For us, you know. At your store. Is manufacture our? Own pieces so. We’re going to start out with the best white T-shirt for every body shape, so I’m like, why is that out there? Why can’t you buy pieces of clothing based on different body shapes so that that that’s the vision of smoother. There you go, that’s your that’s your next. Your next big thing. 

00:46:19 Speaker 1 

OK, I’m gonna wrap this up, but before we go, do you have any? Piece of advice. Because you’ve been. Through such a roller coaster over the last. 5-6 months. What’s your piece of like words of wisdom to anyone who is listening here about running their own business? Yeah, growing their own. 

00:46:38 Speaker 2 

Yeah, I think the things that I have learned and I. I’ve been sleeping better and you know when we first start working together, I. Didn’t sleep very much cause I would. Worry about so much. And to be. Honest I I worry less doesn’t mean I have less to worry about. But I’m worrying. Less, and I think for me. The biggest lesson that I’ve learned? Person to person, everybody says. This, but I’m going to make. Sense of this perseverance, consistency, but also breaking it down like so for me, right? Like I can get overwhelmed by the like. Oh my gosh, you need this much money and this much inventory is coming in and blah blah blah. Whereas now I’m like breaking it down to like these 90 days segments or 90 day plans. For monthly targets and then even. Breaking those steps down further and I think. Like for I have seen such success doing that like it’s just one step in front of the other and. Then all of a sudden, you’re like, oh, I’m there. Like I hit that target or hit that goal, but. Definitely change like how I look at things and it makes it feel achievable to myself as well. 

00:47:42 Speaker 1 

And I think the confidence that you have come not that you weren’t confident at the beginning, but. You show up. You show up to nearly every call with a massive smile on your face, so excited about like you, you are really excited about business. Again, which that just warms my heart. Because if you’re not excited, you don’t make great decisions. You’re just on autopilot, but you’re coming in excited about things, you know, even. We have bad days. It’s the 14th of a month. Not gonna hit it. I should just give up. Right now, it’s like, yeah, no. Alright, so if people want to come and hang out. Ohh before we go. Can you tell us about? Not everybody’s watching on video, but if they are, what is around your wrist right now and why do? You have it. 

00:48:28 Speaker 2 

I’ll take out my wife. She can see it. You know, I didn’t want it like to. OK, so you know how we talked about earlier in this conversation? Uh, my commitment issues. So on my birthday this year when I went and this is a big it’s kind of a joke but not a joke for me. But so I went and got one of the permanent bracelets that you can get on. So what they do is you go in you. Pick out your chain. And they Weld it together because I thought these. Are this is a baby step in terms of? Getting over my commitment issues is welding a bracelet on. To my wrist. But then Sam pointed out, too, that she’s like, and it’s such a good reminder that every time I look at it, right is to keep pushing and to. Like not get caught up. Sort of in that as. Well and it. 

00:49:11 Speaker 1 

Was a reward to yourself for all the hard work that you put in. 

00:49:15 Speaker 2 

Yeah, you’re right, you’re right. 

00:49:15 Speaker 1 

So we did you. Were gonna buy shoes, weren’t you? 

00:49:18 Speaker 2 

I know you’re passing to the wind. They just did, yeah. 

00:49:25 Speaker 1 

Alright, Mavis, if people want to learn more about how to work out. What their body shape is and potentially shop with you as well. Where can they find? 

00:49:34 Speaker 2 

Yeah. So head on over, if you’re on Instagram, it’s at Smithery style and that’s SMITHERY style. Same thing for our website. So smithery style dot. Com and the same. 

00:49:47 Speaker 1 

For Facebook as. Well, listen, thank you so much for sharing your. Journey I just. I love, I mean. I’m I’m along for the journey, so I get to see it. But I just love when you can share what’s happening in your business because it, you know, it isn’t all rainbows and unicorns, but when you have the people and the knowledge and the strategies. And the mindset, like you’ve said all the time, that is the difference between scaling a business and potentially giving up. So thank you so much for being very open and sharing your journey. 

00:50:16 Speaker 2 

Gosh, thank you for having me. Thank you for helping me. 

00:50:25 Speaker 1 

So that’s a wrap. I’d love to hear what insight you’ve gotten from this episode and how you’re going to put it into action if you’re a social kind of person. Follow me at this Selina night and make sure to leave a comment and let. No, and if this episode made you think a little bit differently or gave you some inspiration, or perhaps gave you the kick that you needed to take action, then please take a couple of minutes to leave me a review on your platform of choice, because the more reviews the show gets, the more independent retail and e-commerce. Feels just like yours that we can help to scale and when that happens, it’s a win for you. A win for your community and a win for your customers. I’ll see you on the next episode. 



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