Retail Trends You Need To Know



Michelle Sherrier

Michelle Sherrier is the owner of MC Design Collaboration, a retail consultant specializing in visual merchandising and she is also the host of The Retail Whore Podcast. With over 40+ years in the retail industry including owning 3 stores at the iconic Fred Segal Santa Monica to heading up visuals in the Santa Monica Anthropologie she has done just about every job that retail has to offer. The Retail Whore Podcast started from Michelle doing Instagram live interviews with retailers during the pandemic shut down. Giving retailers a place to talk about how they were pivoting, what was working for them and how they were staying busy. A year later the Retail Whore Podcast was launched. Michelle is a wife, a dog mom to 3 puggles and is an avid lover of all things visual.

Have you ever jumped on a trend and it didn’t sell the way you wanted?

Get ready to tune in to this episode with Michelle Sherrier as she shares her insights on the retail industry and how important it is to know your customers. With 45 years of experience in retail, Michelle is a wealth of knowledge and provides valuable tips for both bricks and mortar and eCommerce businesses.


** The 5X Framework Accelerator Program is now open for application. Click here to know more.

NAME: Ep 381 Customers Michelle Sherrier Retail Trends You Need To Know_audio.mp3
DATE: 2023-04-28

The conversation focuses on how businesses can make sure that customers take into account current trends when selecting products. The speaker discusses how it is important to know your customer and to be aware of the trends that are popular in the market. They go on to give an example of how leopard and animal prints were popular in the US, to the point where everyone from high end to low end was using them. The speaker then moves on to their own experience, discussing how they run an Airbnb business and have noticed that with the current economic uncertainty, bookings have decreased. They emphasize the importance of diversifying income streams in order to be able to survive in uncertain times.

In this episode, the hosts discussed their renovation of the house they are using for Airbnb, which includes a new games room, a sauna, and a combined laundry bathroom. They discussed the importance of providing something to customers that will make them want to come back and the need to consider return on investment. They also discussed their new coach for their Supercharge and 5X programs, Kerry, and how the host made a new friend, Michelle, through talking about work and life. They discussed the importance of retail businesses having a bricks and mortar store, and gave tips to both retail and eCommerce businesses.

Michelle Sherrier is an impressive designer with a lot of credentials and experience. She hosts a podcast titled The Retail Whore Podcast. After listening to her podcast, the speaker contacted Michelle and asked if she would be interested in being a guest on their show. Michelle agreed and the speaker was so excited they sent multiple messages to her. Unfortunately, the speaker had to stand Michelle up as they had to take care of something else. The speaker apologizes and they both proceed with the episode.

Michelle Sherrier is the guest on the podcast called Retail Whore. She has been in retail for 45 years, starting when she was 14 after her mother told her she needed a job. She’s done just about every job in retail, which is why the podcast is called Retail Whore. Michelle moved from Wet Seal to Japan to become a model, and then back to the US to set up showrooms at the Las Vegas gift show. She recently stood up a potential guest for the podcast, but instead of avoiding the situation, she sent a voice message apologizing and taking responsibility for her mistake. This showed the host that she was someone worth having on the show.


0:00:00 “Understanding Market Trends to Maximize Customer Satisfaction”

0:02:23 “Creating a Standout Airbnb Experience: A Conversation with Michelle Sherrier”

0:08:05 Conversation with Michelle Sherrier: Exploring Design Experience and Retail Whore Podcast

0:09:59 Conversation with Michelle Sherrier: A Retail Whore with 45 Years of Experience

0:11:25 Conversation with Entrepreneur: Reflections on Starting a Business and Surviving an Earthquake

0:15:48 Conversation Summary: Reflections on Bankruptcy and Humility

0:17:46 Conversation on Returning to the Retail Industry After Making a Mistake

0:19:55 Heading: The Power of Visual Merchandising and Design in Retail

0:25:08 Heading: Change in the Retail Industry: A Conversation with an Experienced Retail Professional

0:26:53 Exploring How Great Brands Take Storytelling and Merchandising to Ecommerce

0:29:02 Discussion of Rewards Programs and Social Media Strategies for Gen Z Customers

0:32:48 Heading: Exploring the Benefits of Cohesive In-Store and Online Experiences for Independent Brands

0:34:43 Heading: The Importance of Communication and Visual Representation in Business

0:37:07 Exploring Brand Cohesiveness: Strategies for Building a Connection with Customers

0:38:09 Heading: Creating a Conceptual Story for Apparel and Gift Retailers

0:40:10 Conversation Summary: Creating a Floral Candle Concept for Store Meetings

0:43:55 “Understanding the Market and Knowing Your Customer: A Conversation with a Fashion Buyer”

0:52:05 Heading: Adapting to the Changing Retail Landscape: A Conversation with [Name]

0:53:44 Heading: Adapting to the Digital Age: How the Pandemic Changed Retailers’ Strategies

0:55:44 Heading: “The Benefits of Inclusivity and Diversity in Retail”

0:57:15 “Retail Expert Shares Tips on Merchandising, Design, SEO, and More”

0:59:09 Conversation Summary: Michelle Knight and Selena Knight Discuss the Benefits of Podcasting

00:00:00 Speaker 1 

Some of the reason. 

00:00:01 Speaker 1 

That people come to your business is because of your curation. 

00:00:04 Speaker 1 

But at some point, you. 

00:00:05 Speaker 1 

Have to let that go. 

00:00:06 Speaker 1 

And go with the trends. 

00:00:08 Speaker 1 

How do you? 

00:00:09 Speaker 1 

Make sure that they listen to what is happening in the market rather than just what they think. 

00:00:15 Speaker 2 

Well, it’s part listening to us in the market, but really it’s knowing who your customer is and. 

00:00:20 Speaker 2 

And again like. 

00:00:21 Speaker 2 

You go to shows and it’s like the same trend is repeated over and over, and I don’t know if it hit as much in Australia as it did here. 

00:00:28 Speaker 2 

Less but leopard and animal prints were like huge two point where every single from high end to low end every single person and it was almost like well, I don’t have a lot of choice. 

00:00:40 Speaker 2 

So I went in. 

00:00:41 Speaker 2 

I’m like, OK, I’m all in on the animal thing. 

00:00:43 Speaker 2 

Well, guess what, the customers in that area are not fancy. 

00:00:49 Speaker 1 

Hey there and welcome to the bringing business to retail podcast. 

00:00:54 Speaker 1 

If you’re looking to get more sales, more customers, master your marketing and ultimately take control of your retail. 


Or e-commerce buses. 

00:01:04 Speaker 1 

Then you’re in. 

00:01:05 Speaker 1 

The right place. 

00:01:07 Speaker 1 

I’m Celina night, a retail growth strategist and multi award-winning store owner whose superpower is uncovering exactly what your business requires to move to the next level. I’ll provide you with the strategies, the tools and the insight. 

00:01:24 Speaker 1 

You need. 

00:01:25 Speaker 1 

To scale your store or you. 

00:01:27 Speaker 1 

To do is take action. 

00:01:31 Speaker 1 

Ready to get started? 

00:01:36 Speaker 1 

Hey there and welcome to today’s episode of the Bringing business to retail podcast. 

00:01:40 Speaker 1 

Well, it’s school holidays here, Easter school holidays here in Australia and we if you’ve been following me for a while, you probably know that I talk about the Airbnb that we have, we call it the beach house. 

00:01:53 Speaker 1 

It’s down the South Coast of NSW and it is another income stream for us. We’ve diversified our income streams and that it’s a business for us. 

00:02:03 Speaker 1 

What we have noticed is as people start to tighten their belts with a lot of economic uncertainty, the number of bookings that we’ve got is not at the same level as we used to have. 

00:02:17 Speaker 1 

And of course this becomes an issue. 

00:02:20 Speaker 1 

What’s the price of the bookings have gone up? 

00:02:23 Speaker 1 

That’s only gone up because all the expenses that are incurred in running a business have gone up. 

00:02:28 Speaker 1 

So the actual profit margin still the same. 

00:02:32 Speaker 1 

Which means if you have less bookings or less sales, then obviously you’re making less money. 

00:02:38 Speaker 1 

And just like any other business, you have to have a reason for people to come and shop with you. 

00:02:43 Speaker 1 

Or in our case, come and stay with you as we’ve been looking at fun ways that we can make our house stand out a little bit. 

00:02:52 Speaker 1 

And when we bought the house six years ago, we bought it as a bank foreclosure and we renovated the entire thing because, I mean, some of the floor was falling out. 

00:03:01 Speaker 1 

So the whole top floor got renovated and downstairs is a garage, a laundry and an extra bathroom. 

00:03:08 Speaker 1 

But what if you wanted to turn the garage originally into a bunk room? 

00:03:12 Speaker 1 

We weren’t able to do that without a lot of expense, just due to building code, so we kind of just painted the brick walls, put some flooring down, put a ping pong table in, and we call it a games room and it’s functioned quite well up until now. 

00:03:26 Speaker 1 

However, we’re looking at ways that we can bring. 

00:03:30 Speaker 1 

People into the house that make us. 

00:03:32 Speaker 1 

Stand up. 

00:03:33 Speaker 1 

So we decided to. 

00:03:34 Speaker 1 

You go all out in the games room and put up beautiful Wally where we put the Vijay board and some acoustic panels to stop the noise transferring to our neighbours. 

00:03:45 Speaker 1 

We have new flooring going down, didn’t get. 

00:03:48 Speaker 1 

That done this time round. 

00:03:50 Speaker 1 

And lots of paint, lots and lots of paint. 

00:03:55 Speaker 1 

The thing was. 

00:03:55 Speaker 1 

We thought it would take two days. 

00:03:56 Speaker 1 

We had a contract to come in and help us batten out the walls and then we kind of did the rest of it out. 

00:04:02 Speaker 1 

In between all this, my husband and I were still working. 

00:04:06 Speaker 1 

And so, as you can imagine, the amount of time is is kind of limited. 

00:04:10 Speaker 1 

But a week later we managed to get all the walls done. 

00:04:14 Speaker 1 

We got the skating and the after trains in we got it all painted pretty much all that’s left to do now is the flooring, the new flooring, the current flooring. 

00:04:23 Speaker 1 

Still there and I want to put some new paper on one wall so that still has to be done, but also the laundry is now going to be turned into a sauna. 

00:04:34 Speaker 1 

Ohh yeah, I am looking forward to this. I have always wanted a sauna and we have just got one for our own home and we’re going to get one for the the Airbnb and then the old bathroom is being turned into a laundry bathroom combo because it has a shower in there and we don’t need three showers in a three bedroom house. So the shower is going to be pulled out. 

00:04:54 Speaker 1 

And turned into the washer dryer area and then we have a toilet and the basin close that room off and then we have the sauna. 

00:05:02 Speaker 1 

So trying to find ways that are cost effective because. 

00:05:05 Speaker 1 

At the end of the. 

00:05:06 Speaker 1 

Day we have a budget that there’s no there’s no unlimited pool of money for this to happen and we have to. 

00:05:12 Speaker 1 

Look at. We probably won’t get any extra money if we do. It might be like $10 a night. 

00:05:19 Speaker 1 

This is not a case of spending money to make more money. 

00:05:22 Speaker 1 

It’s spending money to get the bookings. 

00:05:24 Speaker 1 

So yes, it is making more money because we will get the bookings, but it’s not like we’re increasing the profit margin, it’s more more about increasing revenue. 

00:05:32 Speaker 1 

And just like any other business, you have to look at return on investment. 

00:05:35 Speaker 1 

So how long is it going to take for us to pay that back? 

00:05:39 Speaker 1 

And that’s one of the things that we always look at. 

00:05:42 Speaker 1 

Anyway, that is a very long intro for the fact that last week I was only kind of working, but that’s what I love about my business is. 

00:05:50 Speaker 1 

That I. 

00:05:51 Speaker 1 

Have this ability. 

00:05:52 Speaker 1 

I have an amazing team who can take the business and keep it running. 

00:05:57 Speaker 1 

If I have other stuff to do and pretty much all I did last week is show up to the calls. 

00:06:02 Speaker 1 

But I needed to show up to which. 

00:06:04 Speaker 1 

Just a lovely place to be in business and it just makes me so happy that after all these years I have a fabulous team. 

00:06:12 Speaker 1 

We are growing, so we are we just put on a new coach for our supercharge and 5X programs, coach Kerry who is. 

00:06:21 Speaker 1 

An e-commerce. 

00:06:22 Speaker 1 

So if you’re in those programs. 

00:06:24 Speaker 1 

You’ll be getting to meet her. 

00:06:25 Speaker 1 

Soon, she’s just going through her tree. 

00:06:27 Speaker 1 

Now, what does all that have to do? 

00:06:28 Speaker 1 

With today’s episode, well, money is. 

00:06:31 Speaker 1 

A lot, I’ll be honest. 

00:06:32 Speaker 1 

But today’s episode was sorry fun. 

00:06:35 Speaker 1 

You know, sometimes you just meet somebody and you just click. 

00:06:39 Speaker 1 

Well, Michelle, Sharia and I, we have this fun little episode where we didn’t quite meet the first time round, but now we have a really fun story. 

00:06:47 Speaker 1 

About how we met and I’ve been in her podcast, she’s been on my podcast. 

00:06:53 Speaker 1 

We really struggled to stop talking. 

00:06:55 Speaker 1 

And in fact, after the podcast, I sent her a little voice. 

00:06:57 Speaker 1 

Message and like hey I. 

00:06:59 Speaker 1 

Really like talking to you. 

00:07:00 Speaker 1 

I think we should do this on a regular. 

00:07:02 Speaker 1 

Basis and I’ll be honest, I never do that. 

00:07:05 Speaker 1 

And so I reached out to her and said let’s do this on a regular basis. 

00:07:09 Speaker 1 

Let’s just meet like, even just once a month and just chat, because we we love chatting about work, we love chatting about business, we love. 

00:07:17 Speaker 1 

Chatting about life. 

00:07:19 Speaker 1 

And she said yes. 

00:07:20 Speaker 1 

So hey, I made a new friend and I was always very, very excited. 

00:07:26 Speaker 1 

Michelle is so smart. 

00:07:28 Speaker 1 

I mean, she’s also absolutely gorgeous. 

00:07:31 Speaker 1 

Can I just say, but so smart and so talented? 

00:07:34 Speaker 1 

And if you have a retail business, especially if you have a bricks and mortar store, you’re going to love today’s episode. But even if you don’t, even if you’re a pureplay e-commerce. 

00:07:45 Speaker 1 

I think you’re going to get a. 

00:07:46 Speaker 1 

Lot of tips out of today’s. 

00:07:48 Speaker 1 

Episode now I toyed with the idea of breaking this podcast up because we do talk for a whole hour, and in fact I have to kind of stop the conversation because I know. 

00:07:57 Speaker 1 

Podcasts that longer than that. 

00:07:59 Speaker 1 

You guys really struggle to listen to, but I would love your feedback because I have another long one. 

00:08:05 Speaker 1 

Do you prefer me to kind of chop them up halfway and give them to you into kind of 2530 minute chunks, or do you just like to continue to listen to the story? 

00:08:18 Speaker 1 

And if you don’t have the whole hour, you come back and listen to it later. 

00:08:21 Speaker 1 

I would love you if you could send me a DM or comment on one of my posts on social media. 

00:08:25 Speaker 1 

And let me know because at the end of the day, we’re trying to provide amazing content for you, but in a way that you can actually consume it. 

00:08:34 Speaker 1 

So let me know. 

00:08:35 Speaker 1 

Do you prefer to chop it up and listen to it in? 

00:08:39 Speaker 1 

Or do you want to listen? 

00:08:40 Speaker 1 

To the whole big episode. 

00:08:42 Speaker 1 

OK, enough for me. 

00:08:44 Speaker 1 

Let’s jump into today’s episode with the. 

00:08:46 Speaker 1 

Fabulous Michelle Sharia. 

00:08:48 Speaker 1 

Alright, Michelle, I am so I’m not going to say. 

00:08:52 Speaker 1 

Enamored, but I. 

00:08:53 Speaker 1 

Am so impressed with your design experience. 

00:08:57 Speaker 1 

Let’s go with. 

00:08:58 Speaker 1 

That like your. 

00:08:59 Speaker 1 

Credentials your street cred and I have to admit, guys, I reached out to Michelle. 

00:09:04 Speaker 1 

I went on a bit of a binge like you haven’t been on the podcast for a while, so I’m just gonna reach out to a bunch of cool people. 

00:09:09 Speaker 1 

And see if they want to get. 

00:09:11 Speaker 1 

And yours was the first one, because the title of your podcast is the Retail Hall podcast. 

00:09:18 Speaker 1 

And then I. 

00:09:18 Speaker 2 

Yes, ma’am. 

00:09:20 Speaker 1 

I looked at like some of your profiles and was like this is a lady that I would drink shots with like this is the kind of person I have to hang out with and I would like to know you. 

00:09:31 Speaker 1 

And if you don’t know what? 

00:09:32 Speaker 1 

To know me, so I. 

00:09:34 Speaker 1 

Think I sent you like 3 messages. 

00:09:38 Speaker 2 

I said you are. 

00:09:39 Speaker 2 

How rude. 

00:09:41 Speaker 1 

It was not. 

00:09:41 Speaker 2 

All set. 

00:09:43 Speaker 1 

And not on purpose. 

00:09:44 Speaker 1 

And you did the most professional thing in the world. 

00:09:47 Speaker 1 

And so Michelle did stand me up. 

00:09:49 Speaker 1 

It was only for like we we do a pre chat just to see if we gel. 

00:09:53 Speaker 1 

And Michelle stood me up for that. 

00:09:55 Speaker 1 

But she was at we were. 

00:09:57 Speaker 2 

Fashion at Magic I was. 

00:09:59 Speaker 2 

I was living in Las Vegas and setting up showrooms. 

00:10:02 Speaker 2 

For the Las Vegas gift show gift show. 

00:10:04 Speaker 2 

Yeah, I have three spaces and I. 

00:10:06 Speaker 2 

Was like living there and I was out of my. 

00:10:08 Speaker 1 

Yeah, I and I can manage. 

00:10:10 Speaker 1 

But she did the most beautiful thing. 

00:10:12 Speaker 1 

She sent me a voice message going. 

00:10:14 Speaker 1 

I am sorry, so sorry. 

00:10:16 Speaker 1 

I’ve never done this before and I was like, you know what? 

00:10:18 Speaker 1 

Again, that is a person that I would. 

00:10:20 Speaker 1 

Like to hang. 

00:10:21 Speaker 1 

Out with that takes some responsibility, goes to the effort of sending me a message like you’re my kind of people. 

00:10:26 Speaker 1 

Welcome to the show, Michelle. 

00:10:29 Speaker 1 

And no one knows. 

00:10:30 Speaker 1 

I haven’t even. 

00:10:30 Speaker 1 

Mentioned who you are. 

00:10:31 Speaker 1 

So welcome to the show. 

00:10:32 Speaker 1 

Please tell. 

00:10:33 Speaker 1 

Us all about yourself. 

00:10:35 Speaker 1 

Thank you. Well. 

00:10:37 Speaker 2 

The podcast is called retail horror because I have literally been in retail. 

00:10:43 Speaker 2 

For 40, I think 45 years I started when I was 14, my mom said she was a single mom and she said you’re not sitting on your *** anymore on the beach. 

00:10:52 Speaker 2 

So you had to get a job and she prompt me promptly drove me to the local mall here in Manhattan Beach, CA. 

00:10:59 Speaker 2 

And I started at the wet seal and it’s like, I just, I’ve had this love affair with retail. 

00:11:03 Speaker 2 

My entire life and I’ve done just about every single job there is to. 

00:11:07 Speaker 2 

Do, which is why it’s called the retail horror. 

00:11:10 Speaker 2 

And I’ve kind of moved my way through. 

00:11:13 Speaker 2 

I I did quit for a bit to go live in Japan as a model when I was 16 or 17, I quit high school and my dad signed off for me to go live in Japan. 

00:11:23 Speaker 2 

Who does that? 


By the way. 

00:11:25 Speaker 1 

My daughter would do that. 

00:11:26 Speaker 1 

My daughter is obsessed with everything. 

00:11:28 Speaker 1 

Japanese is the only class at school that she does well in. 

00:11:32 Speaker 1 

She is in year nine and she’s already doing university level Japanese and it’s the only thing she engages. 

00:11:37 Speaker 2 

Wow, that’s impressive. 

00:11:40 Speaker 2 

With so yeah, I I had an interpreter. 

00:11:43 Speaker 2 

We didn’t. 

00:11:43 Speaker 2 

I didn’t even bother trying. 

00:11:45 Speaker 2 

It was just so go and work. 

00:11:47 Speaker 2 

And here’s your interpreter. 

00:11:48 Speaker 2 

And and I came back and I. 

00:11:52 Speaker 2 

Put an application in to go work at the Fred Siegel sale in Santa Monica. 

00:11:56 Speaker 2 

It’s once a year. 

00:11:57 Speaker 2 

At that time, it was once a year and I got hired as temp and I was the denim girl and they made me stand on like basically a stage with denim around me and like Daisy Duke shorts and like Hawking denim and. 

00:12:12 Speaker 2 

I I guess it I worked well because I I was hired on to stay and then I ended up being a manager and then I was a buyer and then Fred the the beautiful thing about being in the Fred Siegel world is there’s nothing that’s ever going to be like this ever again. 

00:12:29 Speaker 2 

Is that. 

00:12:31 Speaker 2 

All the stories that were he’s passed on now and the name has been sold. 

00:12:34 Speaker 2 

So the name you see at Fred Seabrook airports and SLS hotels is a is a. 

00:12:39 Speaker 2 

The name has been bought by a luxury brand. 

00:12:41 Speaker 2 

After that, within this bubble of Fred Siegel, if you worked your *** off and you proved that you really loved and you really were there and you really worked hard, Fred would pull you aside and say, hey, we have a chance to open a store. 

00:12:54 Speaker 2 

I’m going to back. 

00:12:55 Speaker 2 

You, but I really think you can do it and this. 

00:12:57 Speaker 2 

Is your sink. 

00:12:58 Speaker 2 

Or swim moment. 

00:12:59 Speaker 2 

And so I guess I. 

00:13:00 Speaker 2 

Swam because I had three stores. 

00:13:02 Speaker 2 

As we started. 

00:13:02 Speaker 1 

So did you own the stores? 

00:13:05 Speaker 1 

Ohh wow. 

00:13:06 Speaker 1 

Did you use that? 

00:13:06 Speaker 2 

Federal back. 

00:13:07 Speaker 1 

Do that? 

00:13:07 Speaker 1 

Yeah, all stores. 

00:13:08 Speaker 2 

All stores, all the stores in Fred Seagulls back in the day in Santa Monica and Melrose, everybody was individually owned and operated. 

00:13:15 Speaker 2 

You were under the umbrella of Fred Siegel. 

00:13:19 Speaker 2 

And I think that’s the reason why when we. 

00:13:20 Speaker 2 

Talked about this. 

00:13:22 Speaker 2 

Story that I was talking to and Joshua Tree, what I liked about is. 

00:13:24 Speaker 2 

That it was very much a. 

00:13:27 Speaker 2 

Collaboration or like a Co-op situation, you owned your own inventory. 

00:13:31 Speaker 2 

You know you had your own employees. 

00:13:32 Speaker 2 

You have, but it was you. 

00:13:34 Speaker 2 

Were still and you had it like my store was for single comfort, for single comfort too. 

00:13:38 Speaker 2 

And Fred Segal, environment and I, you know, was lucky enough to be there for, I don’t know how long it was. 

00:13:44 Speaker 2 

I lost my sores during the earthquake that was here in California that. 

00:13:47 Speaker 2 

Leveled so much. 

00:13:49 Speaker 2 

My accounts, my attorney. 

00:13:50 Speaker 2 

Pulled me aside and said alright, we’re pulling. 

00:13:52 Speaker 2 

The plug on you? 

00:13:53 Speaker 2 

You’re like no more and so. 

00:13:55 Speaker 1 

You just glossed over this, but you just told me beforehand this this. 

00:13:59 Speaker 1 

Was not a. 

00:13:59 Speaker 1 

Gloss over moment. 

00:14:00 Speaker 1 

This was actually a life changing moment because you said all your inventory. 

00:14:06 Speaker 1 

And you know, they’ve been paid for, but you couldn’t sell it. 

00:14:09 Speaker 1 

You turn up after the devastation of an. 

00:14:12 Speaker 1 

Earthquake it it was. 

00:14:14 Speaker 2 

It was a very pivotal moment. 

00:14:17 Speaker 2 

I mean, you know, I have a saying that I I use a lot. 

00:14:21 Speaker 2 

Is that everything happens for a reason and change. 

00:14:23 Speaker 2 

Is good and. 

00:14:25 Speaker 2 

You know, if it didn’t happen, there’s. 

00:14:27 Speaker 2 

I think I’d probably would have been at Freddy’s till the bitter end. 

00:14:31 Speaker 2 

I was overextended and everything that we were buying, I don’t know if it’s the same in Australia, but there’s net 30 terms and you it just is delivered in 30 days. 

00:14:40 Speaker 2 

You have to pay for it, broken or not. 

00:14:42 Speaker 2 

And a lot was broken and it was just. 

00:14:45 Speaker 2 

I I was overextended so it was just kind. 

00:14:47 Speaker 2 

Of like the. 

00:14:48 Speaker 2 

Straw that broke the camel’s back and. 

00:14:51 Speaker 1 

So what did you do? 

00:14:53 Speaker 1 

Like I can’t. 

00:14:53 Speaker 1 

Imagine what? 

00:14:54 Speaker 1 

How, how did you get the news? 

00:14:57 Speaker 1 

You said your accountant and your. 

00:14:58 Speaker 1 

Attorney said that’s it. 

00:14:59 Speaker 1 

You have to shut up shop like, yeah. 

00:15:01 Speaker 1 

What do you what? 

00:15:02 Speaker 1 

What goes through your? 

00:15:03 Speaker 1 

Head at that moment. 

00:15:05 Speaker 2 

Well, OK. So if like the back story, I was an *******, like I was 27 and I had three stores at Vertigo, where you go, right? 

00:15:14 Speaker 1 

Oh wow. So. 

00:15:15 Speaker 2 

You go into showrooms and. 

00:15:17 Speaker 2 

People kiss your. 

00:15:18 Speaker 2 

And it’s like, oh, you we want to. 

00:15:20 Speaker 2 

Do for table sit down. 

00:15:21 Speaker 2 

What can we get you? 

00:15:22 Speaker 2 

I I became this assess. 

00:15:25 Speaker 2 

That was just. 

00:15:26 Speaker 2 

OK, I want in that 90 I want. 

00:15:28 Speaker 2 

What doesn’t salary goes. 

00:15:29 Speaker 2 

Back, I want you to fix like Quicksilver, Quicksilver, huge, huge US surf company. 

00:15:34 Speaker 2 

They they totally reject. 

00:15:35 Speaker 1 

But still there is a. 

00:15:36 Speaker 1 

Million, OK, reads some sacks just to cut in. 

00:15:41 Speaker 1 

I actually have a shop in the building, which was the original offices of Quicksilver. 

00:15:48 Speaker 2 

I love that brand. I surf culture is like where my heart is at my husband’s is the next pro surfer. But. 

00:15:56 Speaker 2 

So I was I was going to these big. 

00:15:59 Speaker 2 

Brands to see like. 

00:16:01 Speaker 2 

Spots for 26 red. I mean, they’re not around anymore, but saying I want at 90, I want what doesn’t sell this, that and I want you to redo the store. So Quicksilver redid a whole big portion of my store for free and. 

00:16:14 Speaker 2 

You know when. 

00:16:14 Speaker 2 

You talk and you treat people like that and you think you’re all that in a Big Mac. 

00:16:19 Speaker 2 

When you go down, people are very happy to go to you, see you go down because you. 

00:16:24 Speaker 2 

Are an *******. 

00:16:25 Speaker 2 

And I can say that, but I I will say this that was. 

00:16:27 Speaker 2 

The best lesson? 

00:16:29 Speaker 2 

Honestly that I could have ever asked for at that age to have that much lose it all and have to tuck your tail between your leg and send that e-mail. 

00:16:39 Speaker 2 

Or it was an emails send out letters and call people and then you know. 

00:16:43 Speaker 2 

Fast forward to show up. 

00:16:44 Speaker 2 

It shows again where you burned a lot of people through bankruptcy, had to go through bankruptcy there. 

00:16:49 Speaker 2 

Was no paying it. 

00:16:50 Speaker 2 

Back and then having to show. 

00:16:52 Speaker 2 

Up in the read in the wholesale space again and act like. 

00:16:57 Speaker 1 

Hi I’m back. 

00:17:00 Speaker 2 

I want to write your line and I’m not an ******* anymore. 

00:17:03 Speaker 2 

And I’m really sorry. 

00:17:04 Speaker 2 

And I mean, it was a great lesson and in. 

00:17:07 Speaker 2 

Humility honestly like. 

00:17:09 Speaker 2 

Humility is a gift, and I I’m really glad I went through that because I will never talk to people like that again, and I will always be extremely grateful for the vendors that do things for my retailers now as a consultant. 

00:17:25 Speaker 2 

But yeah, that’s that. 

00:17:27 Speaker 2 

That’s the bankruptcy story. 

00:17:28 Speaker 1 

How did you? 

00:17:29 Speaker 1 

Not at that point. 

00:17:31 Speaker 1 

Like you said you had that it’s. 

00:17:32 Speaker 1 

Kind of come. 

00:17:33 Speaker 1 

To Jesus moment, right? 

00:17:34 Speaker 1 

Like I’ve lost everything. 

00:17:36 Speaker 1 

I was a complete ***. 

00:17:38 Speaker 1 

How do I like a lot of people would have said. 

00:17:42 Speaker 1 

I’m off to finding the. 

00:17:43 Speaker 1 

Industry now, what made you go back? 

00:17:46 Speaker 2 

Well, I, you know, I love retail. 

00:17:48 Speaker 2 

I literally, I love everything about retail. 

00:17:51 Speaker 2 

And I had you know within my stores, I was the buyer and I just the merchandiser and I had a chance to kind of stretch my muscle. 

00:17:57 Speaker 2 

I didn’t know merchandising like. 

00:18:00 Speaker 2 

The level that when I closed my stores, I went into and and ended up getting recruited by anthropology, and that level of visual and because I love retail so much like I knew and that’s all I know. 

00:18:14 Speaker 2 

I mean, honestly, like when you quit high school and you were a model and you’ve been submerged in retail for this long, it’s. 

00:18:20 Speaker 2 

Not like I can just go. 

00:18:21 Speaker 2 

Oh, you know, and I. 

00:18:22 Speaker 2 

Think I’m gonna go be an. 

00:18:23 Speaker 2 

Or I mean it just. 

00:18:24 Speaker 2 

You you just don’t. 

00:18:26 Speaker 2 

It it is you. 

00:18:27 Speaker 2 

You are who you are and it’s it’s embedded in me and it will always forever be embedded in me and. 

00:18:33 Speaker 2 

Do what you know I. 

00:18:34 Speaker 2 

Mean honestly, like you. 

00:18:35 Speaker 2 

You so I I. 

00:18:37 Speaker 2 

I had. 

00:18:37 Speaker 2 

I was lucky enough to go to be recruited by anthropology and and that’s where for visual, you know, the learning the business side and the aesthetic and how they work together and how reporting and how following following your reports also helps you follow like. 

00:18:58 Speaker 2 

You know why sales might have dropped off or is even on. 

00:19:01 Speaker 2 

The floor like. 

00:19:02 Speaker 2 

All that education was so phenomenal, and I that’s one thing I, I and they’re aesthetic. 

00:19:07 Speaker 2 

I mean, come on, let’s be real. 

00:19:09 Speaker 2 

Their aesthetic is just like unreal. 

00:19:11 Speaker 1 

I I was just. 

00:19:12 Speaker 1 

Saying to you before we got on when I. 

00:19:14 Speaker 1 

Had my stores and and I’ll be honest, you have all these skills. 

00:19:18 Speaker 1 

I don’t. 

00:19:19 Speaker 1 

I used. 

00:19:19 Speaker 1 

I am so bad at visual merchandising that I know I know all of the theory. 

00:19:26 Speaker 1 

Like, I could recite it back to you, but my team would say do not put anything. 

00:19:31 Speaker 1 

On the shelves. 

00:19:32 Speaker 1 

Like it’s just gonna make twice as much. 

00:19:33 Speaker 1 

We have to then take it off and put it back. 

00:19:35 Speaker 1 

On because I just. 

00:19:37 Speaker 1 

It’s not my thing and so I used to always say when muscle grows up, I want it to be anthropology. 

00:19:43 Speaker 1 

I remember discovering anthropology, like, I don’t know when I first opened my stores and just thinking. 

00:19:50 Speaker 1 

There’s a whole other world out there that isn’t this corporate, you know, table upon table with plastic risers. 

00:19:57 Speaker 1 

I don’t know how much you love plastic risers and like we can be in this kind of dream like state where people love to come and look. 

00:20:06 Speaker 1 

I’m not going to say we ever replicated that, but as a destination. 

00:20:10 Speaker 1 

Well, my team will always like I used to read everything I used to follow anthropology people on on their blogs back in the day, and they would talk about how they’ve been given a brief and everyone gets given. 

00:20:22 Speaker 1 

And please correct me if I’m wrong. 

00:20:23 Speaker 1 

Everyone gets given a brief, but you get to interpret it your own way, but you get a budget to do that. 

00:20:28 Speaker 1 

And she would, she would say. 

00:20:29 Speaker 1 

And this is what we did. 

00:20:30 Speaker 1 

And then she would have pictures of what other people did. 

00:20:32 Speaker 1 

And their interpretations and. 

00:20:34 Speaker 1 

I used to. 

00:20:34 Speaker 1 

Soak that up and I’d be like I’d be like to my tea. 

00:20:37 Speaker 1 

OK, so this is how they did it and read this blog post I’m giving you the same thing I’m giving you a brief and a budget and you just you just tell me what you need and I have great people who would come up with the most amazing displays for like $300.00, but then they would call suppliers and say, hey, do you have any like broken stock or whatever we can use for our shop windows? 

00:20:57 Speaker 1 

And we got so good at it, we. 

00:20:58 Speaker 1 

Used to charge people. 

00:21:00 Speaker 1 

Like charge vendors to be in our windows. 

00:21:04 Speaker 2 

Ah yeah, the. 

00:21:06 Speaker 2 

The the the big there were the visual packets that we would get. 

00:21:10 Speaker 2 

It was like, you know, quarterly and it was everything from what you know your non negotiables the display that you had to have you know what departments were going to be in it, what velocity items. 

00:21:21 Speaker 2 

And then it was, you know, we always called it dumpster diving because it was like, OK, what can we find in alleys and, you know, trash and, you know, flea markets? 

00:21:30 Speaker 2 

It was it. 

00:21:30 Speaker 2 

I mean, it was a magical, magical. 

00:21:32 Speaker 2 

Place to work. 

00:21:34 Speaker 1 

And so was that, that defining moment where you or did you even know this where you realized that the visual? 

00:21:41 Speaker 1 

Merchandising and design plays such a big part in how much things sell. 

00:21:47 Speaker 2 

And I still because my. 

00:21:49 Speaker 2 

You know, I was at anther for seven years and I realize I’m just not meant to. 

00:21:53 Speaker 2 

Be in corporate at all. 

00:21:54 Speaker 2 

Like I I just don’t deliver the message. 

00:21:57 Speaker 2 

Well, like I’m pretty hot and dry. 

00:22:00 Speaker 2 

It’s like, what happened? 

00:22:01 Speaker 2 

We left Friday. 

00:22:02 Speaker 2 

It was a brand new setup and it’s totally unstocked now. 

00:22:07 Speaker 2 

Like it’s like wrecked like did. 

00:22:09 Speaker 2 

No one maintain it? 

00:22:10 Speaker 2 

With what happened and. 

00:22:11 Speaker 2 

Incorporate you need to deliver that message a different way and I was like, OK, I’m. 

00:22:17 Speaker 1 

I just this is not my thing. 

00:22:20 Speaker 2 

So I I I left and I started my own brand MC design collaboration. 

00:22:25 Speaker 2 

That’s what I do now for my clients, and that storytelling is one thing. 

00:22:29 Speaker 2 

I’m on my soapbox on a lot about because. 

00:22:34 Speaker 2 

The answer does storytelling very well, and and with retailers, the storytelling is what helps create add-on sales, you know, so. 

00:22:43 Speaker 2 

I just set up pantry in someones store last week and cause food here for trends like food pantry like table top and food items is so big right now here and you know pairing up salt and salt pigs and jams and cute little spoons and tying them on. 

00:23:00 Speaker 2 

All of this. 

00:23:01 Speaker 2 

Is storytelling and it’s also creating out on sales. 

00:23:03 Speaker 2 

And and that that is very much learned from Anthro and it’s still what I instill in my retailers now that I work for and set up. 

00:23:12 Speaker 1 

For can I ask you a question? 

00:23:15 Speaker 1 

How do you? 

00:23:17 Speaker 1 

Build a design. 

00:23:19 Speaker 1 

This was always the question my team used to ask which was how do we build something beautiful and people be OK to take the product off the display. 

00:23:29 Speaker 1 

Like, how do you put the product? 

00:23:31 Speaker 1 

How do you put enough product of all the things that you’re displaying in a beautiful design so that people can take it without the design being ruined? 

00:23:38 Speaker 1 

Could you just mention? 

00:23:39 Speaker 1 

That like an Anthro? 

00:23:39 Speaker 1 

That the you would have it fully stocked and then you come back? 

00:23:42 Speaker 1 

Yeah, after the weekend. 

00:23:43 Speaker 1 

And the thing was a mess. 

00:23:44 Speaker 1 

So how do you? 

00:23:45 Speaker 2 

Do that in. 

00:23:46 Speaker 1 

An independent store. 

00:23:48 Speaker 2 

It’s training and developing your team. 

00:23:50 Speaker 2 

I mean really, it’s like I work with when I work in stores, I I a lot of times the owner will say can you work with so and so? 

00:23:56 Speaker 2 

So you can explain to her why, and there’s a a definite philosophy of why we do things a certain way and and in explaining that to team members only strengthens their understanding, but it also helps them maintain it. 

00:24:10 Speaker 2 

I mean, you’re always going to have like, I mean, Anthem, it was sort of unfair for me to say that because. 

00:24:16 Speaker 2 

So yeah, I was in the 3rd St. 

00:24:18 Speaker 2 

Promenade Store in Santa Monica and it’s like that and rock center where the two highest volume stores in the company at that point and granted at that point there was only probably 14 locations there. 

00:24:27 Speaker 2 

But you know they will do $100,000 in a day in that store. So it’s like, you know. 

00:24:36 Speaker 2 

I can’t believe you didn’t. 

00:24:37 Speaker 2 

Restart that. 

00:24:37 Speaker 2 

It’s like really Michelle, like. 

00:24:39 Speaker 1 

No, but it’s true that and I I I I I say you’re not being a ***** because the The thing is if it’s not really stock, they’re losing money, yeah. 

00:24:47 Speaker 1 

There there is a responsibility to keep the design stock so that you can continue to make sales and if they have to go and find a. 

00:24:55 Speaker 1 

Sales associate and ask if they’ve got. 

00:24:57 Speaker 1 

Them one some. 

00:24:57 Speaker 1 

People just won’t do that. 

00:24:58 Speaker 1 

They’ll just look out. 

00:24:59 Speaker 1 

But too, it’s wasting your team’s. 

00:25:01 Speaker 1 

Time when they. 

00:25:02 Speaker 1 

Could have just stopped it, so I don’t think you’re being a bit at all. 

00:25:05 Speaker 1 

I think that is actually. 

00:25:06 Speaker 1 

Just proper business management. 

00:25:08 Speaker 2 

It is, but there’s always, like, I’ll talk to some of my stores and she said, you know, where I will loosen up my grip a little bit, it’s like. 

00:25:17 Speaker 2 

If you your store looks like that and. 

00:25:20 Speaker 2 

You only did 5000 and it’s like usually you do between 10 and 15 just like. 

00:25:25 Speaker 2 

Yeah, absolutely. 

00:25:26 Speaker 2 

What the hell happened? 

00:25:27 Speaker 2 

She goes. 

00:25:28 Speaker 2 

But you look at it and it’s like, hit a really busy day. 

00:25:31 Speaker 2 

And it’s like I have to like, I’d rather have you on the floor selling people and if. 

00:25:36 Speaker 2 

We miss out sales. 

00:25:37 Speaker 2 

And a couple $15 candles. 

00:25:39 Speaker 2 

Or whatever. 

00:25:40 Speaker 2 

So be it like it it’s like. 

00:25:43 Speaker 2 

And I understand that now it’s like pick and choose your battle. 

00:25:46 Speaker 2 

And and I think a lot of stores when there is no customer service I think for those stores that have such a heavy customer service, it is more important like you’re there engaging with the customer and you know you’re you’re you’re you’re there, you’re present and as opposed to like being so task oriented. 

00:26:04 Speaker 2 

Like I’ve gotta. 

00:26:04 Speaker 2 

Stop the floor like sat. 

00:26:06 Speaker 2 

I I’ve. 

00:26:07 Speaker 2 

I’ve learned that now. 

00:26:08 Speaker 2 

But it’s also taken a lot of. 

00:26:09 Speaker 2 

Time time away from my what I was like at Anthill. 

00:26:14 Speaker 1 

How do you? 

00:26:15 Speaker 1 

Think I mean, I could talk to you about this. 

00:26:18 Speaker 1 

Like we I think we have like a 15 minute chat. 

00:26:19 Speaker 1 

That went for an hour and 15 minutes. 

00:26:23 Speaker 1 

So clearly we love. 

00:26:24 Speaker 1 

To talk, but. 

00:26:25 Speaker 1 

But you’ve been through so much in terms of change and and I just I’ve only been in this industry for 15 years and I just know. 

00:26:34 Speaker 1 

17 years and I already know what the difference is between when I started. 

00:26:37 Speaker 1 

To what it. 

00:26:38 Speaker 1 

Is now, but how do you think great brands take that storytelling, that merchandising, that customer journey? 

00:26:50 Speaker 1 

The online forum like into e-commerce, how? 

00:26:52 Speaker 1 

Who does it, who does it well and why do you think they do it well? 

00:26:57 Speaker 2 

Anthro free people does a great job. 

00:26:59 Speaker 2 

I mean, I think that’s that’s why it’s funny because there is actually a class in a college. 

00:27:05 Speaker 2 

I forget what college it is that actually talks. 

00:27:07 Speaker 2 

One of the tough topic is. 

00:27:10 Speaker 2 

The disconnect of e-commerce and with the retail and experiences like and I I think that you know when you pull stock images off the web or you use a vendor stock images, you’re already giving up some of your. 

00:27:25 Speaker 2 

Or who your brand is like. 

00:27:27 Speaker 2 

You’re you. 

00:27:28 Speaker 2 

You’re you’re not developing it yourself and. 

00:27:31 Speaker 2 

I think the more time that you spend. 

00:27:35 Speaker 2 

Developing it as as what your store looks like in the ways that you shoot it, how you’re styling the apparel like whatever that is like, how you’re staging your Instagram flat lays all of it. 

00:27:48 Speaker 2 

I think if you keep in trend with what your you are as a brand and what your store feels like. 

00:27:54 Speaker 2 

Including the people that shop. 

00:27:56 Speaker 2 

That will relay more to e-commerce. 

00:27:58 Speaker 2 

But that’s a hard. 

00:27:59 Speaker 2 

One because it’s. 

00:28:00 Speaker 2 

You know, so many people don’t have time to to. 

00:28:04 Speaker 2 

That’s why so many people pull stock images because they don’t have time. 

00:28:06 Speaker 1 

And the budget. 

00:28:09 Speaker 2 

To go out and do a photo shoot with. 

00:28:10 Speaker 2 

But I mean, one of the brilliant things which that like one of my accounts had who’s they’re in Philadelphia. 

00:28:16 Speaker 2 

And it’s a very, very junior store. 

00:28:19 Speaker 2 

And she’s very smart. 

00:28:21 Speaker 2 

She’s my age and she’s very. 

00:28:22 Speaker 2 

Smart as she has. 

00:28:23 Speaker 2 

All the girls part of their job is. 

00:28:26 Speaker 2 

To post TikTok videos. 

00:28:28 Speaker 2 

And that is part of their job and the expectation and it has it has kept her brand looking fresh it it kept some in social media wise in the front. 

00:28:38 Speaker 2 

I mean it’s it’s a very smart. 

00:28:40 Speaker 2 

And because I mean, like I said, she’s my age. 

00:28:42 Speaker 2 

And it’s like, it’s not like she’s gonna go out selling many like crop tops and but all these young girls that work for her, they’re so cute and have these rocking bodies that like, you know, and every day they’re on her feet and it and and they use them, they embed it in their website as well. 

00:28:42 Speaker 1 

Yes, I know on Twitter. 

00:28:59 Speaker 2 

So it feels like Luna check. 

00:29:02 Speaker 1 

Can I just say that we I’ve talked about this, I don’t know if you know the Grand Princess Polly. 

00:29:07 Speaker 1 

So big FMCG brand Gen. 

00:29:11 Speaker 1 

Z totally may if you ever want to see someone who does a rewards program, well, they are my go to for the best reward program ever. 

00:29:22 Speaker 1 

But all gendered are the Gen. 

00:29:25 Speaker 1 

Z as you guys call it. 

00:29:27 Speaker 1 

And they are so good at. 

00:29:31 Speaker 1 

Bringing like bringing that into those people and the rewards program into that genre, I guess you know that age group. 

00:29:41 Speaker 1 

But the reason I mentioned the rewards program is you’re saying this lady is smart, right? 

00:29:46 Speaker 1 

She’s like, I’ll get the kids, the kids in their quotes to do to do the the Tik toks, but actually. 

00:29:52 Speaker 1 

In that den. 

00:29:53 Speaker 1 

Graphic that is something that they aspire to, like the the the self like this. Like the dopamine hit you get from like I am on my companies, you know, TikTok videos like you and I were just like, oh, whatever. But they’re just like they. 

00:30:09 Speaker 1 

They they suck. 

00:30:10 Speaker 1 

That stuff in and it is so motivating for them. 

00:30:13 Speaker 2 

It’s this generation now. I mean, anybody who’s not utilizing their social media and they’re not on TikTok and they’re not. 

00:30:21 Speaker 2 

On reels is. 

00:30:23 Speaker 2 

Yeah, they it, it’s it. 

00:30:24 Speaker 2 

They suck it. 

00:30:25 Speaker 2 

Up, but you? 

00:30:26 Speaker 2 

Know hopefully people are age, start to embrace it more with results. 

00:30:31 Speaker 2 

That is literally what is. 

00:30:32 Speaker 2 

Driving people’s businesses right now. 

00:30:35 Speaker 1 

The reason I mentioned the the Princess Polly Rewards program is because when you get to specific tears, you have a chance. 

00:30:42 Speaker 1 

Not a guarantee, but you have a chance to be featured on their Instagram. 

00:30:48 Speaker 1 

Oh, this is Madeline. 

00:30:49 Speaker 1 

This is clearly something that they they have, and I’ve actually interviewed Princess Polly and they’ve talked about how they’ve done so much behavioral demographics and profiling and talked to their customers and. 

00:31:01 Speaker 1 

That is not you don’t get that at the bottom level. 

00:31:03 Speaker 1 

I think there are 5 levels you. 

00:31:04 Speaker 1 

Only get that. 

00:31:05 Speaker 1 

At Level 3. 

00:31:06 Speaker 1 

So you have to spend a decent amount of money before you even go into the chance to be featured on their Instagram. 

00:31:12 Speaker 1 

And that is why I I believe you know understanding those intrinsic values of your ultimate customers, because what you? 

00:31:22 Speaker 1 

But you think as a reward doesn’t mean that that’s what. 

00:31:24 Speaker 1 

They think like I would never. 

00:31:25 Speaker 1 

I think. 

00:31:26 Speaker 1 

Ohh hey you get a. 

00:31:27 Speaker 1 

Chance to be featured on my Instagram I’m like. 

00:31:32 Speaker 1 

But they know that that is something that their customers aspire to. 

00:31:36 Speaker 1 

And so your client is like, so on the money because she’s like, well, I don’t have to do the work. 

00:31:41 Speaker 1 

Two, they get something out of it. 

00:31:42 Speaker 1 

And three, it brings me in customers. 

00:31:44 Speaker 1 

And I I’ve done nothing firstly. 

00:31:45 Speaker 2 

Yeah, and it keeps the brand looking and feeling like the brand both online and and in store. 

00:31:52 Speaker 2 

I mean I, I I thought that was really smart. 

00:31:55 Speaker 2 

The only store that I know. 

00:31:57 Speaker 2 

That is doing that, I mean, as far as my stores, which I I this is because it’s also the youngest store I have like the most junior, but I thought it was so brilliant. 

00:32:01 Speaker 1 


00:32:07 Speaker 1 

I I’ve I’ve got one client who does that as well. Not on TikTok because they’re people go and hang out and they do it on Instagram reels. All of her team doing Instagram reel. 

00:32:17 Speaker 1 

And what they have actually found. 

00:32:19 Speaker 1 

Is customers start to find and you know they get affiliated with a specific person. 

00:32:26 Speaker 1 

So it’s like, oh, I’m following like. 

00:32:28 Speaker 1 

I want to sell one. 

00:32:29 Speaker 1 

I’m gonna follow Sarah because she wears the kind of stuff that I wear or, you know, I look, she looks like me. 

00:32:34 Speaker 1 

Or I just like her vibe. 

00:32:35 Speaker 1 

And so having those different people, actually. 

00:32:37 Speaker 1 

Attracts more customers. 

00:32:39 Speaker 1 

Because they can feel that affiliation with the different sales associates and not and you know it just takes so much pressure off the business owner. 

00:32:49 Speaker 2 

I think also that has a that. 

00:32:51 Speaker 2 

Gives you a chance to show that. 

00:32:53 Speaker 2 

You’re a little. 

00:32:53 Speaker 2 

Bit more diversified. 

00:32:54 Speaker 2 

It also shows that you know, like we love our employees and and and then when they go to the store, I’m sure the employees are somewhat like celebrity. 

00:33:03 Speaker 2 

Like like ohh I. 

00:33:04 Speaker 2 

Follow you and it’s like that just. 

00:33:05 Speaker 2 

Like is one more dopamine. 

00:33:07 Speaker 1 

Head and they will need these. 

00:33:09 Speaker 1 

Instant dopamine hit. 

00:33:10 Speaker 1 

So John said. 

00:33:13 Speaker 1 

OK, so you think they’re doing it well? 

00:33:16 Speaker 1 

Do you think that that is a missed? 

00:33:18 Speaker 1 

I think you said even said this make maybe a missed opportunity that so many independent brands could actually jump onto. 

00:33:26 Speaker 1 

That that connection between in store and online, like the difficulties are, yes, it’s going to cost money and yes, it’s going to take time and you’ve given us some great strategies to to look at how we could. 

00:33:37 Speaker 1 

Maybe minimise the time. 

00:33:38 Speaker 1 

Thing, but do you think that? 

00:33:41 Speaker 1 

If they if if indie Pran brands actually sat down and spent the time looking at how do we get these more cohesive experiences, it would give them an edge over big business. 

00:33:53 Speaker 2 

I think so. 

00:33:54 Speaker 2 

Usually what? 

00:33:54 Speaker 1 

Happens is 2 different. 

00:33:56 Speaker 2 

It’s like a a tech person who usually is not like the creative person, and then it’s the visual people who are the creative people. 

00:34:06 Speaker 2 

And I I think when it’s two different people doing two different jobs. 

00:34:11 Speaker 2 

And trying to make a tech person. 

00:34:15 Speaker 2 

Get creative, you know. 

00:34:16 Speaker 2 

And and it’s like it’s, I know for the people like tech people are are like my dad was an engineer, just not creative. 

00:34:23 Speaker 2 

Like I can do anything on a computer, but if it’s like tell me how to like do display like forget it. 

00:34:29 Speaker 2 

So I think for those who do have two separate people is is like some companies. 

00:34:35 Speaker 2 

Anthro does weekly meetings like everybody on all sides sits on it because that’s the thing too is I think a lot of times there’s not communication. 

00:34:44 Speaker 2 

The communication within companies I’ve found is extremely bad like. 

00:34:49 Speaker 2 

Certain departments talk to certain departments and then other departments have nothing to do with it, and they’re big changes that are happening that you know all of a sudden they’re finding out that they don’t really have anything to do with it. 

00:34:59 Speaker 2 

So they haven’t been queued into it, but I think that, you know, they’re the beautiful part is that. 

00:35:04 Speaker 2 

They are weekly. 

00:35:05 Speaker 2 

Meetings and they are company wide emails that you know you get. 

00:35:09 Speaker 2 

It’s like the big box of visual communication. 


It’s like. 

00:35:14 Speaker 2 

You are like literally eat sleeping, drinking what is happening within the brand as a company. 

00:35:20 Speaker 2 

And I think that if people do spend more time, both the tech part of it and the creative part of it, and how do we create that? 

00:35:28 Speaker 2 

But I mean again, like and most visual people aren’t the most techie people either. 


So but I. 

00:35:33 Speaker 2 

Think if both parties are talking about. 

00:35:35 Speaker 2 

How to do this? 

00:35:36 Speaker 2 

There’s got to be some kind of solution that both of them work on, but if there’s not that cohesiveness between the brand. 

00:35:44 Speaker 2 

It’s two different parties talking. 

00:35:46 Speaker 1 

Yeah. I just. 

00:35:47 Speaker 1 

Remember that I I I yeah. 

00:35:49 Speaker 1 

You always have those moments that you remember, and I remember being in my store one day and someone coming to the door and standing at the door and looking from side to side. 

00:35:59 Speaker 1 

And I was like, ohh, hi, you know come. 

00:36:01 Speaker 1 

On in and she’s like I’m not. 

00:36:02 Speaker 1 

Sure, if I’m. 

00:36:03 Speaker 1 

In the right place I’m looking. 

00:36:04 Speaker 1 

I’m looking. 

00:36:05 Speaker 1 

For this store and I’m like. 

00:36:07 Speaker 1 

Tell me. 

00:36:07 Speaker 1 

Just like. 

00:36:08 Speaker 1 

Ohh this is not what I expected from the website and. 

00:36:11 Speaker 1 

That was like. 

00:36:13 Speaker 1 

Uh, you know, nice to my heart. 

00:36:15 Speaker 1 

But I think that was my first. 

00:36:17 Speaker 1 

Like I had I opened I. 

00:36:19 Speaker 1 

Had a business degree, but I opened a retail business because I saw a need and that you couldn’t buy these products in the country. 

00:36:24 Speaker 1 

So I’m like, well, hey, I’ll bring the products in. 

00:36:27 Speaker 1 

I didn’t know anything about. 

00:36:29 Speaker 1 

Branding and design. 

00:36:30 Speaker 1 

And that was one of those moments when. 

00:36:33 Speaker 1 

I was like ohh like if a. 

00:36:34 Speaker 1 

Customer thinks that. 

00:36:36 Speaker 1 

Like I’ve done something like there’s something I need to fix, like something doesn’t work and that I think that was my moment where I started delving into the rabbit hole of how do you build that connection? 

00:36:47 Speaker 1 

Cause this is we’re talking like when. 

00:36:48 Speaker 1 

E-commerce first started out like 2007, 2000 and. 



00:36:51 Speaker 1 

8 and so. 

00:36:53 Speaker 1 

My website was built like on OS commerce and it was really ugly. 

00:36:57 Speaker 1 

And it did. 

00:36:57 Speaker 1 

It had nothing to do with it. 

00:36:59 Speaker 1 

It looked nothing like the store. 

00:37:00 Speaker 1 

It never. 

00:37:01 Speaker 1 

Had occurred to me that. 

00:37:02 Speaker 1 

People would expect the same thing because. 

00:37:05 Speaker 1 

E-commerce was so. 

00:37:06 Speaker 1 

New back then? 

00:37:07 Speaker 1 

But that was like that moment where. 

00:37:08 Speaker 1 

I jumped in going. 

00:37:09 Speaker 1 

I have to learn how do I build that connection and that cohesiveness so when people turn up, they do think I’m in the right place and you. 

00:37:18 Speaker 1 

Get that you know. 

00:37:19 Speaker 1 

Anthropology is the best example because you go to. 

00:37:21 Speaker 1 

The website and. 

00:37:22 Speaker 1 

All of the styling is done as if you were in a store and you go to the store and you’re like, yeah, this. 

00:37:27 Speaker 1 

This is the place like I can. 

00:37:28 Speaker 1 

Smell the place from a. 

00:37:29 Speaker 2 

Mile away. 

00:37:30 Speaker 2 

Like I can even the even the the fonts and even the artwork and all of that all feels like anthropology because everybody’s. 

00:37:39 Speaker 2 

On the same page, as far as what their visual. 


Is supposed to be. 

00:37:45 Speaker 1 

Do you any like any? 

00:37:47 Speaker 1 

Any insight for people who are thinking? 

00:37:50 Speaker 1 

How do I? 

00:37:51 Speaker 1 

Like you’re so good at this. 

00:37:52 Speaker 1 

And this is what you do for a job. 

00:37:54 Speaker 1 

How do you tell your retailers to build that information packet to do that communication to build that brand? 

00:38:01 Speaker 1 

Like, what are some tips people can think? 

00:38:03 Speaker 1 

Oh, maybe I hadn’t thought about that before, and if I. 

00:38:05 Speaker 1 

Did that. 

00:38:06 Speaker 1 

It would make a big difference. 

00:38:09 Speaker 2 

You know, I mean, I think it starts for gifts and apparel are very different, but also in the same sense kind of not I I from Anthro. 

00:38:16 Speaker 2 

One of the things they do beautifully is they concept so. 

00:38:21 Speaker 2 

The apparel has concepts. 

00:38:23 Speaker 2 

Garden Party was one it. 

00:38:24 Speaker 2 

Was all the floral dresses. 

00:38:26 Speaker 2 

And then in that is built in floral candles and whatnot, and the home departments all have their concepts and I see. 

00:38:34 Speaker 2 

For me and my retailers, it starts at the buying process where I’m kind of curating collections and I tend to give things names. 

00:38:44 Speaker 2 

It just comes from April. 

00:38:45 Speaker 2 

It’s like, OK, this is going to be the pantry section and who lives here? 

00:38:50 Speaker 2 

What does she? 

00:38:51 Speaker 2 

What does she look like? 

00:38:52 Speaker 2 

What does she? 

00:38:52 Speaker 2 

What does she eat? 

00:38:53 Speaker 2 

What does she drink? 

00:38:55 Speaker 2 

And then I will go back and I’ll build a storyboard of. 

00:39:00 Speaker 2 

You know what we bought? 

00:39:02 Speaker 2 

And kind of same thing anther did in a much much less detailed fashion. 

00:39:06 Speaker 2 

But you know what the vibe looks like what? 

00:39:09 Speaker 2 

You know, I’ll go through because fashion and gifts, well, they’re very different. 

00:39:14 Speaker 2 

Fashion comes out with their what it looks like and the prints and the the lifestyle and it rolls out slowly to gift. 

00:39:23 Speaker 2 

So I’ll pull images from apparel magazines that are like, you know, say garden party and it’s someone running through a field of greens and a floral. 

00:39:32 Speaker 2 

That’ll be the the The Who is she? 

00:39:35 Speaker 2 

And then build in layering and what we bought to go back with it. 

00:39:40 Speaker 2 

These pants, these T-shirts, this, blah, blah, blah, this dress, these, these groups of dresses, these accessories and then these home pieces that we’re going to show with it as well. Floral candles, we wrote these floral. 

00:39:51 Speaker 2 

Rules. You know what? 

00:39:52 Speaker 2 

Over and then we’ll do a store meeting and this is like we only do this four times a year because you can’t do it all the time because the concepts will kind of stay stay the same, but they they will change out little by little and they change out again in in the next quarter, but have a meeting. 

00:40:04 Speaker 1 

OK, Jeff. 

00:40:09 Speaker 2 

This is who she is. 

00:40:10 Speaker 2 

This is what here’s some of that. 

00:40:11 Speaker 2 

We’ll have samples of what? 

00:40:12 Speaker 2 

The styles are like so we can see it touch it, feel it, smell the candles, and then we’ll set up a workshop and we’ll decide we’re going to work it. 

00:40:21 Speaker 2 

We’re like either close the store for a day or do an overnight or whatever it is and scrape the entire section that we’re setting. 

00:40:28 Speaker 2 

And then you start building it in and it. 

00:40:30 Speaker 2 

Then it becomes storytelling like let’s do a garden trellis here, and then we’ll do potted plants, and then we’ll show a shirt on a stand up mannequin on the table, and then we’ll fold down whatever. 

00:40:42 Speaker 2 

And in between that, we’ll have the floral candles and. 

00:40:46 Speaker 2 

Really it’s it it. 

00:40:47 Speaker 2 

If you started at the buying process and you kind of curate it, you know, if you think about it that way, whether you’re doing a big stripe collection or stripes is what it’s all about for next. 

00:40:56 Speaker 2 

Season and you kind. 

00:40:58 Speaker 2 

Of build in from that. 

00:40:59 Speaker 2 

The more you storytelling, the more you you give your employees and team like this is what it looks like for the season. 

00:41:05 Speaker 2 

It also what happens is it makes it a lot easier when merchandise starts to arrive. 

00:41:10 Speaker 2 

Your team already knows where it’s going, especially once it’s all set up. 

00:41:13 Speaker 2 

They’re like, oh. 

00:41:13 Speaker 2 

This is floral. 

00:41:14 Speaker 2 

Must be for this because I remember in anther we’d have concepts and it was like you always knew when they bought something and it was like. 

00:41:21 Speaker 2 

This doesn’t go into any of the concepts, so we’re going to arbitrarily put it in this concept and you get it. 

00:41:26 Speaker 2 

And it was like, what is? 

00:41:27 Speaker 2 

This does it go at all with this? 

00:41:29 Speaker 2 

And it’s like. 

00:41:30 Speaker 2 

Alright, you’re kind of burying it cause it doesn’t go at all, but they’ve told you this is part of a deal all summer collection. 

00:41:37 Speaker 2 

It’s like, oh, it’s like you vary a bit. 

00:41:40 Speaker 2 

I think the more that that. 

00:41:41 Speaker 2 

That your team, the more you communicate with the visual standard is and what the visual is going to look like for this season. 

00:41:48 Speaker 2 

And the more? 

00:41:49 Speaker 2 

You show them examples and get them excited. 

00:41:52 Speaker 2 

Then when it starts rolling in the store, even after it’s set up, starts rolling in the store, they know where it goes. 

00:41:56 Speaker 2 

They’re excited. 

00:41:57 Speaker 2 

They you know. 

00:41:58 Speaker 2 

It’s just it’s storytelling. 

00:42:01 Speaker 1 

I think you have. 

00:42:03 Speaker 1 

Said something that I don’t even think I had thought of. 

00:42:06 Speaker 1 

I mean, we have we have a guide that is like how to go into we we we talked about you go open to buy but we got going to a trade fair or going to market and it’s how to work out how much to spend and the kind. 

00:42:19 Speaker 1 

You know the types. 

00:42:20 Speaker 2 

The categories of products. 

00:42:22 Speaker 1 

But you’ve just kind. 

00:42:23 Speaker 1 

Of I need to go back and adjust that. 

00:42:24 Speaker 1 

Now that you’ve said this, which is. 

00:42:27 Speaker 1 

Putting in that concept like what is this going to go with? 

00:42:31 Speaker 1 

What concept is this going to to fall into? 

00:42:33 Speaker 1 

Because that one little nugget that you’ve just given us, I think would completely change people’s buying strategies. They’ve never thought about that before. They’re just like, OK, I need, you know, 20% needs to be. 

00:42:47 Speaker 1 

Outerwear or I need 10% in this gift range and 30% in this gift range, if they even thought of it all. But now that you’re saying that. 

00:42:56 Speaker 1 

As they’re going through, even if they don’t know right from the beginning, but they find that signature piece when they’re looking to buy, then they start going ohh. 

00:43:05 Speaker 1 

What’s gonna go with that rather than ohh, that’s nice. 

00:43:08 Speaker 1 

I’ll get that. 

00:43:08 Speaker 1 

That’s nice. 

00:43:09 Speaker 1 

I’ll get that. 

00:43:09 Speaker 1 

And then when I know. 

00:43:10 Speaker 1 

This was this. 

00:43:11 Speaker 1 

Was definitely me. 

00:43:12 Speaker 1 

It comes in and you’re like. 

00:43:13 Speaker 2 

Where’s our help? 

00:43:13 Speaker 1 

Ohh where is that going? 

00:43:16 Speaker 2 

Yeah, that that. 

00:43:17 Speaker 2 

I mean, that’s part of the reason why I started thinking and I still do my buying like that. 

00:43:21 Speaker 2 

I mean we just finished magic fashion events was in February here and all. 

00:43:27 Speaker 2 

And it like. 

00:43:28 Speaker 2 

I I now I go by the rule of walk the show the first day just so. 

00:43:32 Speaker 2 

You can see. 

00:43:34 Speaker 2 

Because fashion was all over the place this year for contemporary and for juniors and whatnot, it was like matching sets. 

00:43:41 Speaker 2 

Pinks, still huge, like everything that was crocheted the last season is totally gone. 

00:43:46 Speaker 2 

I mean, it was so all over the board. 

00:43:48 Speaker 2 

So I literally like who I was with, I said. 

00:43:51 Speaker 2 

Let’s we’re going. 

00:43:52 Speaker 2 

To walk the show and see what reveals itself and and and after a while, obviously, because everyone’s repeating kind of the same thing. 

00:43:58 Speaker 2 

You can kind of. 

00:44:00 Speaker 2 

All right, like like the two piece matching sets I was like. 

00:44:04 Speaker 2 

No, and by the end of. 

00:44:05 Speaker 2 

The show I’m like I’m on board. 

00:44:06 Speaker 1 

I would be with you. 

00:44:08 Speaker 1 

I would have been like ohh kill me now. 

00:44:11 Speaker 1 

Oh my. 

00:44:11 Speaker 2 

God and I was. 

00:44:12 Speaker 2 

Like everything from like that, vans, checkerboard print and shorts and shirt matching. 

00:44:18 Speaker 2 

And I was like. 

00:44:19 Speaker 2 

You know 8/18. 

00:44:20 Speaker 2 

Rows into magic I was. 

00:44:22 Speaker 2 

Like I’m down with this. 

00:44:23 Speaker 2 

Let’s do it. 

00:44:24 Speaker 2 

It was like, but you know. 

00:44:27 Speaker 2 

And and again. 

00:44:28 Speaker 2 

Like, that’s when we started concepting. 

00:44:30 Speaker 2 

So it was like, you know, we did the whole checkerboard thing. 

00:44:33 Speaker 2 

And there’s a lot in gift that we could play back with checkerboard. 

00:44:36 Speaker 2 

She’s going to bring in van and. 

00:44:37 Speaker 2 

The checkerboard and it became this. 

00:44:39 Speaker 2 

Amazing curated little like almost like. 

00:44:42 Speaker 2 

A pop up shop. 

00:44:43 Speaker 1 

That is a thank you, because if people get nothing out of this other than your amazing story that I think is life changing that is business changing advice. 

00:44:53 Speaker 1 

Because, I mean, I I would be. 

00:44:55 Speaker 1 

I’ve never thought of it like that. 

00:44:57 Speaker 1 

Like it might sometimes happen. 

00:45:00 Speaker 1 

Like it might fall into that you’re like, oh, this would go with that. 

00:45:02 Speaker 1 

But I know that I’ve been in that situation way too often when, you know, 60 days on from trade fair, all the stuff starts arriving here. 

00:45:09 Speaker 1 

Like, did I? 

00:45:10 Speaker 2 

Oh my God. 

00:45:10 Speaker 1 

Did I what? 

00:45:11 Speaker 1 

What did I? 

00:45:11 Speaker 1 

Why did I buy that? 

00:45:13 Speaker 2 

Oh my God I I mean I’ve. 

00:45:15 Speaker 2 

I’ve been because there’s a lot of buyers. 

00:45:17 Speaker 2 

Just go and buy also the other trip fall is like I just yeah, they you can tell they buy. 

00:45:22 Speaker 2 

What they like like. 

00:45:23 Speaker 1 

Oh yes. 

00:45:24 Speaker 1 

Let’s talk. 

00:45:24 Speaker 1 

More about that. 

00:45:25 Speaker 2 

It it’s like, OK, you liked it all, and now it’s all here and none if it goes together. 

00:45:32 Speaker 2 

And in those cases, I’ve had to go with the rule. 

00:45:35 Speaker 2 

When in doubt, color it. 

00:45:36 Speaker 2 

It’s like alright, color block, it’s all. 

00:45:40 Speaker 2 

This is our green section and this is our blue section. 

00:45:42 Speaker 2 

I mean it it honestly honestly it’s like sometimes but it’s like the buying not even for your customers for your customer but a lot of it is really like I want a piece of this. 

00:45:54 Speaker 2 

I’m going to take the. 

00:45:55 Speaker 2 

Large in the. 

00:45:56 Speaker 2 

In the pack set like. 

00:45:58 Speaker 2 

Like he. 

00:46:00 Speaker 2 

And and then it. 

00:46:01 Speaker 2 

I mean, I’ve had a client. 

00:46:02 Speaker 2 

It was. 

00:46:03 Speaker 2 

It’s a spa and it goes high and spa. 

00:46:07 Speaker 2 

They kept buying yoga wear and it’s like yoga wear is not selling and it’s like, OK, let’s let’s move out of this. 

00:46:12 Speaker 2 

Put it on sale. 

00:46:13 Speaker 2 

Get your money back and put it something else since, like the holidays came and went. 

00:46:17 Speaker 2 

I came back in January and down to the damn did they didn’t buy a whole new yoga group like why, why, why are we going? 

00:46:18 Speaker 1 

Well, yeah. 

00:46:25 Speaker 2 

Well we, you know, we thought it was so cute. 

00:46:28 Speaker 2 

And we wanted to try it again. 

00:46:29 Speaker 2 

Like try it again like you’re sitting on a year’s worth of inventory, that even at 50% off you haven’t sold and yet you decide to buy more. I’m like, OK. 

00:46:38 Speaker 1 

Hey, business 101 making money. 

00:46:42 Speaker 2 

Oh my God. 

00:46:43 Speaker 1 

Can we just maybe just talk a little bit about your strategies for not even taking, you know, not even thinking about? 

00:46:52 Speaker 1 

OK, I’m gonna buy that thing because I want to take one out of it, but I’m gonna buy that because I like it. 

00:46:57 Speaker 1 

How do you get your clients and the people listening now to change their mindset to yes, of the reason that people come to your business is because of your cure? 

00:47:09 Speaker 1 

But at some point you have to let that go and go with the trends. 

00:47:12 Speaker 1 

So how? 

00:47:13 Speaker 1 

Do you convince your customers? 

00:47:15 Speaker 1 

Like you said, the matching set thing you’re like. 

00:47:17 Speaker 1 

No, no, no. 

00:47:17 Speaker 1 

Oh, my God. 

00:47:18 Speaker 1 

Yes, we’re gonna have to do this. 

00:47:20 Speaker 1 

How do you make sure that they listen to what is happening in the market rather than just what they think? 

00:47:27 Speaker 2 

Well, it’s part listening to us in the market, but really it’s knowing who your customer is. 

00:47:31 Speaker 2 

Honestly like, you know, my colossal mistake with the store that I still do magic with is. 

00:47:39 Speaker 2 

And and again like you go to shows and it’s like the same trend is repeated over and over, and I don’t know if it hit as much in Australia as it did here in the US, But leopard and animal prints were like huge like 2 point where every single from high end to low end every single person. 

00:47:57 Speaker 2 

And it was almost like, well, I don’t have a lot of. 

00:48:00 Speaker 2 

So I went in and like, OK, I’m all in on the animal thing. 

00:48:04 Speaker 2 

Well, guess what? 

00:48:06 Speaker 2 

The customers in that area are not fancy animal. 

00:48:08 Speaker 2 

And it’s like that, that ****** little side comments I kept hearing like, yeah, the animal stuffs not selling stuff, it’s like. 

00:48:17 Speaker 2 

Thank you. 

00:48:17 Speaker 2 

Nice to the hearts like and. 

00:48:19 Speaker 2 

It’s funny now because now I’m training her. 

00:48:22 Speaker 2 

She’s doing the buying and I kind of stand back to the side and she’s much more conservative and she’s much more afraid and and. 

00:48:28 Speaker 2 

You know, she said. 

00:48:30 Speaker 2 

You know, she bought, I forget what she bought last season. 

00:48:32 Speaker 2 

She goes not a lot. 

00:48:33 Speaker 2 

Of it sold them some animal print. 

00:48:37 Speaker 2 

Animal print debacle for me and. 

00:48:39 Speaker 1 

It’s like the best bedazzled T-shirt. 

00:48:41 Speaker 2 

Everybody buyers gonna have it. 

00:48:43 Speaker 2 

And if you don’t take risks, you’re never gonna know. 

00:48:46 Speaker 2 

But knowing the more I know and the more I stuck to who our customer is. 

00:48:52 Speaker 2 

And it’s and you’re going to die when I tell you this. It’s A5 store pharmacy. And here in the US pharmacies. 

00:49:00 Speaker 2 

You know the the the amount of money they’re getting for drugs and whatnot is not the same. 

00:49:04 Speaker 2 

So they have all this real estate. 

00:49:05 Speaker 2 

So a lot of people are doing gift and guess what? 

00:49:07 Speaker 2 

Apparel is the number one department in all of my pharmacies because to captive audience. 

00:49:13 Speaker 2 

But I fell away from the original. 

00:49:17 Speaker 2 

Lesson that I knew was a $40 price point, something that didn’t need a fitting room to try on and an instant gratification thing where if she bought it, she took it home. 

00:49:28 Speaker 2 

She’s like, ohh whatever it’s it’s like $30. I’ll just give it to my friend. It became. Yeah, it wasn’t. It wasn’t a purse. 

00:49:35 Speaker 1 

With a make or break thing. 

00:49:37 Speaker 2 

So that was my fault because I. 

00:49:40 Speaker 2 

Did not listen to what I knew was who’s our customer? 

00:49:45 Speaker 2 

What is our price point? 

00:49:46 Speaker 2 

Where is she gonna wear it? 

00:49:47 Speaker 2 

Is she gonna wear it? 

00:49:48 Speaker 2 

And it’s like I didn’t that, that it was my mistake. 

00:49:51 Speaker 2 

But I think that it if you know who your customers that things may be trending and you can touch on it like the pink thing here in the US was huge. 

00:50:00 Speaker 2 

Yeah, see, I mean. 

00:50:01 Speaker 2 

Like so much pink, it was gross. Like I it was like. And that’s not the pharmacy’s customer. But I said to Aaron, you should try a couple pieces. 

00:50:11 Speaker 2 

Just to give a pop to the other stuff, so it looks like you’re still there. 

00:50:15 Speaker 2 

You’re still showing on trend. 

00:50:18 Speaker 1 

But you’re showing. 

00:50:18 Speaker 2 

It with other. 

00:50:19 Speaker 2 

Things that you are going to sell and if you don’t sell those three or four skews, you may go on sale. 

00:50:24 Speaker 2 

So be it. 

00:50:25 Speaker 2 

But as a visual, as an apartment, those few pieces show that you are still within the trend. 

00:50:32 Speaker 2 

It’s helping sell other pieces that you’ve had, and it’s you’re testing the waters. 

00:50:37 Speaker 1 

And, you know, sometimes it works, right? 

00:50:39 Speaker 1 

I’m guessing to that pharmacy that you’re talking about, all those things, but the customer demographic is generally going to skew a little bit older would. 

00:50:47 Speaker 2 

It’s like you know it’s it’s like everything there are the older customers, but they’re buying the grandkids Jelly, cat flesh and all the games. 

00:50:56 Speaker 1 

Is Jolly cat even a? 

00:50:57 Speaker 1 

Thing there too is huge here. 

00:50:58 Speaker 2 

Oh my God. 

00:50:59 Speaker 2 

They’re huge. 

00:50:59 Speaker 2 

I’m I do their their displays for the US so but they you know it’s they they it became where we were were known for apparel now so now you know they may not be dropping off. 

00:51:16 Speaker 2 

They’re there to actually shop the apparel. 

00:51:19 Speaker 2 

In the gift. 

00:51:19 Speaker 2 

Department cause it. 

00:51:20 Speaker 2 

I expanded their their gifts expand. 

00:51:22 Speaker 2 

I I really expand so we have a baby department with the kids department. We have a women’s apparel. 

00:51:29 Speaker 2 

Then we have a table top where we do amazing dishes and dish towels. 

00:51:34 Speaker 2 

We have a crystal section and then we have an inspiration. 

00:51:36 Speaker 2 

Section which you know is where like the crosses and God bless you and all like you know, if you’re going to a pharmacy, a lot of you are sick. 

00:51:44 Speaker 2 

So you needed you. 

00:51:44 Speaker 2 

Still need to have that. 

00:51:45 Speaker 2 

But by far large. 

00:51:47 Speaker 2 

It’s crazy. 

00:51:48 Speaker 2 

Like the apparel, it’s and it’s like people. 

00:51:50 Speaker 2 

Coming in just. 

00:51:51 Speaker 2 

To shop apparel. 

00:51:53 Speaker 1 

That is so smart, and that is one of the things that I’ve been talking to. 

00:51:57 Speaker 1 

So here in Australia we have new do you that have newsagents in in America so where you buy your paper like a newspaper? 

00:52:05 Speaker 2 

There’s there’s some news stands still, Barnes and Noble. 

00:52:08 Speaker 2 

The bookstore here still has a pretty large, but sadly, I think magazines are kind of like on the down. 

00:52:15 Speaker 1 

So hey, we would have what we call news agent and it would have your newspaper, your magazines, your gift cards, and they would sell bus tickets and lottery tickets. 

00:52:24 Speaker 1 

And of course, like you said, with the pharmacies, the amount of money they bring in from those things is like cents on the dollar for each thing that they sell. 

00:52:33 Speaker 1 

And they have had to to like the good ones that are selling business have had to turn into really beautiful gift stores. 

00:52:41 Speaker 1 

And but the ones that don’t are the ones that are saying. 

00:52:45 Speaker 1 

You know that people aren’t buying newspapers and it’s. 

00:52:47 Speaker 1 

Like, well, no, they’re not. 

00:52:48 Speaker 1 

But you’ve got a business here and you have this opportunity because generally in very small shopping centers, you know there’s maybe 1520 stores in there, a supermarket. 

00:52:57 Speaker 1 

And so people are going there every single day to get their daily replenishments, and if they need to get. 

00:53:03 Speaker 1 

A gift. It’s. 

00:53:04 Speaker 1 

Just easy like the convenience and so having to curate a range of beautiful things. 

00:53:10 Speaker 1 

Is what keeps them in business and not just tat like so many of them go to to the markets and the buying fares and they just buy cheap stuff, but they haven’t actually thought about the fact that their clients are not going there for cheap stuff, they’re going. 

00:53:23 Speaker 1 

Before a beautiful $40 candle for. 

00:53:26 Speaker 1 

My friend’s birthday. 

00:53:27 Speaker 1 

And said, like you said, knowing your customer is so important, but also it’s it’s that adapting. 

00:53:31 Speaker 1 

And I really like what you said about the pharmacy taking in those pops of colour and maybe even taking in those different kind of items just to. 

00:53:39 Speaker 1 

Test it out like. 

00:53:40 Speaker 1 

You have to be testing this stuff out because you never. 

00:53:42 Speaker 1 

Know what your customers want. 

00:53:44 Speaker 2 

We’ll also you know if the pandemic taught us anything is those who are unwilling to pivot and change and try new things are quickly being ushered out like like, think about how many people no one was on stories no one was going live before the pandemic. 

00:53:59 Speaker 2 

And you know the stories here, the stories like the older generation. 

00:54:04 Speaker 2 

Stores where I’m like. 

00:54:05 Speaker 2 

I’m not going to get on camera. 

00:54:06 Speaker 2 

I don’t even have. 

00:54:07 Speaker 2 

They don’t even have a website that’s like up and running like they have a website, but there’s nothing on it because they don’t have anyone to put. 

00:54:13 Speaker 2 

But they weren’t willing to go on stories they they didn’t do. 

00:54:16 Speaker 2 

You know, they didn’t even do Facebook like. 

00:54:20 Speaker 2 

Like and now the pandemic. 

00:54:23 Speaker 2 

What is changed is like going live is almost a standard now with a lot of apparel lines and and I. 

00:54:30 Speaker 2 

Think that’s what’s so? 

00:54:31 Speaker 2 

Cool to see now this newer generation of retailers and. 

00:54:35 Speaker 2 

Like out out-of-the-box they think. And that guy said. 

00:54:38 Speaker 2 

To somebody on an interview like. 

00:54:40 Speaker 2 

One of the things that the magic. 

00:54:41 Speaker 2 

Show which blew my mind. 

00:54:42 Speaker 2 

It was. 

00:54:43 Speaker 2 

So cool to see. 


He was. 

00:54:44 Speaker 2 

These girls are going live from the show floor life running into like, I’m sorry I I would not carry my light ring around. 

00:54:53 Speaker 2 

But man, they’re like rain and they’re going live and they’re in a booth and they’ve got their whoever trying out. 

00:54:53 Speaker 1 

You can either. 

00:54:58 Speaker 2 

Like, isn’t this cute? 

00:54:59 Speaker 2 

It’s, you know, they already have the retail price figured out, you know, blah, blah, blah, and they’re taking. 

00:55:04 Speaker 2 

Orders live and they’re turning around going. 

00:55:07 Speaker 1 

We’ll take 10 pack. 

00:55:08 Speaker 2 

I mean, I was like, that is brilliant because that’s not whole other level than what my generation of retailers is doing. 

00:55:16 Speaker 2 

And and there are stores that are older generation that are like starting to do it and like they’re like pushing novel. 

00:55:22 Speaker 2 

They’re like, I’ll, I’ll do it. 

00:55:24 Speaker 2 

But the stores, I think that are unwilling to change and the in that. 

00:55:28 Speaker 2 

Old school mentality of like we’ve always done. 

00:55:30 Speaker 2 

It like this. 

00:55:32 Speaker 2 

Are slowly the ones like the pandemic like quickly are ushering things out and all these. 

00:55:37 Speaker 2 

New kids with. 

00:55:38 Speaker 2 

These new ideas and doing things differently, because why not? 

00:55:41 Speaker 1 

Why not just want to just get? 

00:55:42 Speaker 2 

Try doing. 

00:55:43 Speaker 1 

And I think I. 

00:55:44 Speaker 1 

Don’t know are. 

00:55:44 Speaker 1 

You probably see this as well, but. 

00:55:47 Speaker 1 

The difference between what? 

00:55:49 Speaker 1 

Is and I love this. 

00:55:50 Speaker 1 

I will just put my hand up and. 

00:55:51 Speaker 1 

Say I love this. 

00:55:52 Speaker 1 

The difference between what is acceptable today and what was acceptable even five years ago in terms of like we are so much more inclusive and diverse. 

00:56:04 Speaker 1 

And I love that for all the freaks and the geeks, because that’s most of my family. 

00:56:08 Speaker 2 


00:56:09 Speaker 1 

I love that people are allowed to be themselves now and you can be a little bit ostentatious or you can be a little bit introverted. 

00:56:16 Speaker 1 

You can wear a mask if you want to. 

00:56:18 Speaker 1 

Don’t want to like all of that is OK and that is actually what attracts people to want to. 

00:56:23 Speaker 1 

Hang out with you. 



00:56:24 Speaker 2 

Yeah, sadly, here in America, there’s a lot of that’s it’s not OK, but it’s like for me, like I the all inclusive and wear a rainbow wig. 

00:56:35 Speaker 2 

If you want do what do. 

00:56:36 Speaker 1 

You could it. 


You do you like what? 

00:56:37 Speaker 1 

For yeah, yeah. 

00:56:38 Speaker 2 

Makes you happy and that’s OK. 

00:56:42 Speaker 1 

But I feel like I have. 

00:56:44 Speaker 1 

To finish up this conversation. 

00:56:45 Speaker 1 

Pretty much now, because we’ve been talking for about an hour and I’m pretty sure that we could continue to talk for another hour. 

00:56:51 Speaker 1 

But we’ll do that on your podcast. 

00:56:54 Speaker 1 

If people want some help with this kind of stuff, because let’s be honest, they’re not going to. 

00:56:58 Speaker 1 

Get it? 

00:56:58 Speaker 1 

From me. 

00:56:59 Speaker 1 

Where can they reach out to you and have a chat? 

00:57:02 Speaker 1 

Because I know that you do consulting. 

00:57:04 Speaker 1 

I know you actually have people. 

00:57:06 Speaker 1 

You’ll go and help people inside of their stores. 

00:57:08 Speaker 1 

In the US. 

00:57:09 Speaker 1 

And maybe they just want to listen to your podcast as well because you got a lot to say. 

00:57:13 Speaker 1 

And that’s a really good. 

00:57:15 Speaker 2 

Will the Retail Core podcast is on all. 

00:57:19 Speaker 2 

You can also go to. 

00:57:20 Speaker 2 and pull up anyone? 

00:57:23 Speaker 2 

And the great thing about that? 

00:57:24 Speaker 2 

Is that I have so. 

00:57:25 Speaker 2 

Many retailers that are also talking about what works for them, what doesn’t, we have people talking about merchandising and design and we have. 

00:57:34 Speaker 2 

People we have. 

00:57:35 Speaker 2 

All these different conversations going on because retail is very lonely. 

00:57:39 Speaker 2 

I think everyone’s in their stores all day and you don’t get a chance to get out and it’s like to be able to listen to some. 

00:57:44 Speaker 2 

And get new ideas like I just did one yesterday that released it was all about merchandising and I’ve had so many DM’s. 

00:57:51 Speaker 2 

I’m like, thank you so much for redoing our store today. 

00:57:53 Speaker 2 

Like all the suggestions you were making about risers you’d mentioned I hate plastic risers. 

00:57:58 Speaker 2 

Like I won’t let any of my. 

00:57:59 Speaker 2 

Stores use them. 

00:58:00 Speaker 2 

So I tell people like, forget like the plastic riser like. 

00:58:04 Speaker 2 

Use this, this and this so. 

00:58:05 Speaker 2 

The reason why you’ll hear about that. 

00:58:06 Speaker 1 

Use some books. 

00:58:07 Speaker 1 

Use use, use a tissue box, use some things. 

00:58:10 Speaker 2 

Pavers like tree slices. 

00:58:13 Speaker 2 

There’s so many great and again. 

00:58:15 Speaker 2 

Storytelling and then MC design collaboration, the Instagram and my websites. 

00:58:22 Speaker 2 

Not as great my Instagram, I’m on it all the time. 

00:58:25 Speaker 2 

I’m on stories. 

00:58:26 Speaker 2 

I’m talking to people through as I’m doing displays I’m, you know, I I try and give as much information as I can. 

00:58:34 Speaker 2 

Just on jobs I’m doing. 

00:58:35 Speaker 2 

As well as like things I’m seeing, or you know what, whatnot. And and that’s and to design collaboration. And if you do, you want to go to the website and sent to the MC 

00:58:47 Speaker 2 

And I think that’s. 

00:58:49 Speaker 1 

It that’s everything. 

00:58:50 Speaker 1 

Just just follow her on Instagram and listen to the podcast and you’ll get loads of information. 

00:58:55 Speaker 1 

Lots, lots and lots. 



00:58:58 Speaker 1 

Thank you, Michelle. 

00:58:58 Speaker 1 

This has been like one of my favorite podcasts because it is just like sitting down, having a glass of wine and having great conversation, which is one of my most favorite things in the. 

00:59:08 Speaker 1 

World to do. 

00:59:08 Speaker 1 

Thank you. 

00:59:09 Speaker 1 

Thank you. 

00:59:09 Speaker 2 

So much. 

00:59:10 Speaker 2 

I’m so excited to interview you now. 

00:59:12 Speaker 2 

And the tables on you. 

00:59:14 Speaker 1 

Alrighty, we will chat again soon. 

00:59:16 Speaker 1 

Yes, so that’s a wrap. 

00:59:20 Speaker 1 

I’d love to hear what insight you’ve gotten from this episode and how you’re going to put it into action. 

00:59:26 Speaker 1 

If you’re a social kind of person, follow me at the Celina night and make sure to leave a comment and let me know. 

00:59:34 Speaker 1 

And if this episode made you think a little bit differently or gave you some inspiration, or perhaps gave you the kick that you needed to take action, then please take a couple of minutes to leave me a review. 

00:59:47 Speaker 1 

On your platform of choice, because the more. 

00:59:50 Speaker 1 

Reviews the show gets. 

00:59:51 Speaker 1 

The more independent retail and e-commerce. 

00:59:54 Speaker 1 

Stores just like yours that we can help to. 

00:59:58 Speaker 1 

And when that happens, it’s a winter year, a win for your community and a win for your customers. 

01:00:06 Speaker 1 

I’ll see you on the next episode. 




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